PODCAST: Communities WANT Police Officers to be WARRIORS with Jerrod Hardy | TIR 062
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Communities WANT Police Officers to be WARRIORS with Jerrod Hardy | TIR 062
Jerrod Hardy
Meet this Weeks Guest: Jerrod Hardy
Over 21 years of law enforcement experience in assignments such as Patrol, SWAT, School Resource Officer, Training Coordinator, Academy Coordinator, Hiring, Recruiting and Background Investigations. I use these experiences, lessons learned and my love for coaching and writing to continue to give back to our law enforcement professionals as well as those who simply want more from life. I currently write for Policeone.com and have a regular column, The Coaches Corner, in which I share defensive tactics information as well as career and transitional advice and experiences.
As someone who bucked tradition and walked away from law enforcement at a young age, 46 years old, I love sharing the journey with all of you in my writing, speaking and podcasting. My first book, "Extraordinary People in Ordinary Places" was published in late 2019 and is available at Amazon.com.
If you are looking for an inspiring, positive speaker, writer and trainer with years of real world and applicable experience, I would love to hear from you to discuss how we can work together.
You can view my work, programs and testimonials on my website www.teamhardy.net
Jerrod’s Book
Now available as an audiobook: Extraordinary People in Ordinary Places by Jerrod Hardy
Show Notes from This Episode
We know first-hand the struggle of trying not to take the job home with us and let it affect our families. We know the toll the law enforcement career can have on marriages and relationships. And we also have been frustrated by the lack of authentic leadership in our agencies. This Law Enforcement Podcast was designed to help you overcome the mental toll of the law enforcement career and the negative effects it can have on your personal life.
Hosted by active-duty law enforcement, we bring you two weekly podcasts. On Thursday, in The Interview Room we sit down with amazing guests who provide actionable advice on leadership, mental health, and relationships from their lived experiences. On Monday, in Morning Roll Call, you and I enjoy a cup of coffee and discuss current events, offer encouragement, and discuss practical steps for achieving the life we were meant to live.
Go Deeper:
Step 1: SUBSCRIBE to the Podcast wherever you are streaming it.
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Step 2: FOLLOW us on social media, so you never miss an update.
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Topics we discuss:
“Coaching Cops to Believe in Themselves.”
“Cops can’t have all skills and no heart.”
“Cops should be their brother’s keeper.”
“Cops don’t need MORE training; they need BETTER training.”
“Law Enforcement needs Courageous people.”
“Law Enforcement supervisors MUST know their people.”
“CompStat served a purpose, but is it the best?”
“We have to change the law enforcement profession within ourselves first.”
How to live on purpose.
CONNECT with Jerrod:
WEBSITE: https://www.teamhardy.net
WEBSITE: https://www.theonpurposepodcast.com
LINKEDIN: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lawenforcementcoaching/
RESOURCES mentioned:
AFTER the episode:
• LEAVE US AN iTUNES rating and review! [This is a HUGE help]
• VISIT OUR Website: https://www.ontheblueline.com/
• EMAIL me your feedback: Feedback@OnTheBlueLine.com
• Get the eBook, “How the law enforcement makes you cynical and what you can do about it” by Wayne Mulder.
On The Blue Line was founded and is operated by active-duty law enforcement to fulfill the mission of helping law enforcement overcome the mental health toll of the profession to become better leaders & protectors on & off the job.
We strive to create a world where law enforcement life expectancies are equal with the general population.
HONOR | EMPOWER | EDUCATE | DEFEND
An On The Blue Line Media LLC production.
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TRANSCRIPTION OF EPISODE. Please note this is a new service we are offering and there will be spelling, grammar and accuracy issues. This transcription is offered as a convenience to our listeners, but at this time it is not guaranteed to be accurate.
00:00:10:02 - 00:00:31:12
Wayne Mulder
Welcome, my friend, to the On the Blue Line podcast for law enforcement. I am your host, Wayne Mulder. And this is the podcast that helps law enforcement officers overcome the mental health toll of the profession. Why? To become better leaders and protectors on and off the job. This week on the podcast, I sit down with Jared Hardy. We talk about selling everything and living in an Airstream.
00:00:31:14 - 00:00:48:15
Wayne Mulder
You got. You can't miss that part. And some of the stories that go along with that you definitely do not want to miss and why so many of us get paralyzed by analysis and why we arguably don't need more training. We need better training in law enforcement beyond the Blue Line podcast. It starts now.
00:00:48:17 - 00:01:04:02
Because, you know, it's only going to get scary seasons know when to change. Your father wanted to last for ever. Oh, you know, things have to stay the same.
00:01:04:04 - 00:01:26:17
Wayne Mulder
So welcome back to the podcast. Yes, it's been a while. And yes, I'm going to leave it right there. I apologize. But if you are watching this on YouTube, if you're watching this on Rumble, you're seeing that we do have the temporary studio of the new podcast, essentially long, long, long story short, which some other podcast, probably a morning roll call go into more detail.
00:01:26:17 - 00:01:52:18
Wayne Mulder
But we have since moved to another part near kind of where we live, but into a 1926 farmhouse. So it's practically new, but it's been quite the experience and of course some of the things that come with that to try to get a podcast studio up has been interesting, but we have the temporary studio up and going and we have some great plans for a longer term solution for some interview shows we've been wanting to do.
00:01:52:18 - 00:02:12:11
Wayne Mulder
So thank you all for you continue to reach out the emails, I get, the messages I get, and those of you who continue to listen to episodes, it's been amazing. So thank you so much. The other good news is if you've been following, if you're a longer longtime listener finish command school, which was six months of my life doing it for graduate credit.
00:02:12:11 - 00:02:33:12
Wayne Mulder
So it was a very long six months of my life. But thank God that is over. And now I'm able to get back to concentrating full time on this podcast again. Other than I say full time. But that's probably not a true statement full time in that I'm not doing school on the right now, but I still have all the other responsibilities that so many of us have.
00:02:33:18 - 00:02:54:19
Wayne Mulder
So let me tell you about this week's podcast. Guest I tell you, I have really enjoyed getting to know Jared Hardy. He's got over 21 years of law enforcement experience. He's had, like so many of us, a lot of different assignments patrol, SWAT, school resource officer, training coordinator, academy coordinator, worked at hiring recruiter and did some background investigations.
00:02:54:21 - 00:03:18:14
Wayne Mulder
But he used these experiences and the lessons he learned and his love for coaching and writing to continue to give back to the law enforcement profession. And he went on, He's done writing for police one Bcom and he has a regular column, The Coach's Corner, in which he talks about defensive tactics and other information that helps both in law enforcement career but also transitional advice.
00:03:18:14 - 00:03:46:02
Wayne Mulder
From his experience. He was someone who walked away from law enforcement at a young age, 46 years old, and he loves to share the journey about what he did and how it changed him through his writing, his speaking, his podcasting And his first book came out in 2019, but it is now also available on Audible. I confirmed that before this released, so you can definitely go to the links in the show notes and the name of that book is Extraordinary People in Ordinary places.
00:03:46:02 - 00:04:02:17
Wayne Mulder
And as you can imagine, I just love that title and it's right in line with the message of On the Blue Line. So he's inspiring positive speaker, writer and trainer, and he's got years of real world applicable experience. And quite frankly, I'm just honored to have been able to sit down with him and the conversations we've had off line.
00:04:02:19 - 00:04:13:17
Wayne Mulder
Just a phenomenal guy and someone that I hope we can develop a friendship that goes on for years. So without taking any more time, here is this week's guest, Jared Hardy. Well, Jared, welcome to the show.
00:04:13:19 - 00:04:29:20
Jerrod Hardy
Wayne. Thank you for having me. It's an honor, my friend. I appreciate appreciate what you're doing for our community and all your listeners out there and I just tip my hat for you for for stepping up and putting yourself out there like this. It's a great testament to your character.
00:04:29:22 - 00:04:43:08
Wayne Mulder
Well, thank you so much. And yeah, you know, it's neat seeing all the different podcasts that are coming out and just really people in general that are helping people in the law enforcement profession such as yourself. So the pleasure is mine. So thank you for coming on.
00:04:43:10 - 00:04:46:05
Jerrod Hardy
And looking forward to it. I did some prep work, so I'm ready.
00:04:46:11 - 00:04:51:23
Wayne Mulder
Okay, well then let me start as I always do, Coffee or tea, Jared.
00:04:52:00 - 00:04:55:09
Jerrod Hardy
Not even close coffee all day, every day.
00:04:55:11 - 00:05:05:06
Wayne Mulder
You and me both. Every once in a while. Yeah. Maybe a little tea here and there. But are you. Are you a black coffee or do you like that cream and sugar or how do you like that coffee?
00:05:05:12 - 00:05:14:02
Jerrod Hardy
Well, I try to be a little healthier. I'll go a little coconut oil, and then I get some good healthy fats in my coffee and some cinnamon.
00:05:14:04 - 00:05:17:20
Wayne Mulder
Interest in coconut oil. Not coconut milk, huh?
00:05:17:22 - 00:05:26:10
Jerrod Hardy
No, no. Yeah. I don't like really a lot of the milk stuff, so. Yeah, a little scoop of coconut oil, a little sprinkle of cinnamon. I'm a happy camper.
00:05:26:14 - 00:05:36:19
Wayne Mulder
Okay, Now, is that coming? That's a new one. I have yet to have anyone say coconut oil in their coffee. Is that essentially, like the ones that put butter in it and so forth? Were you trying to get those healthy scents?
00:05:36:21 - 00:05:41:02
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, for sure. But I can. With the coconut oil, you just don't have the dairy aspect of it.
00:05:41:08 - 00:05:42:09
Wayne Mulder
Gotcha. Okay.
00:05:42:09 - 00:05:43:00
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah.
00:05:43:02 - 00:05:44:04
Wayne Mulder
Very cool.
00:05:44:06 - 00:06:05:14
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah. Then I, I love coffee. As to the coffee tour, when I was in Costa Rica, I went for, like, a day to a small family owned coffee farm. And just to be that out on coffee. Yeah. Here's a little interesting fact. Did you know coffee beans aren't actually a bean? The receipt of a fruit?
00:06:05:16 - 00:06:10:06
Wayne Mulder
It seems like I knew that, but not like I could have actually passed the test with that. Yeah.
00:06:10:08 - 00:06:22:12
Jerrod Hardy
So no grapes, Almost sort of a little farm I went to in Costa Rica. They are actually making coffee wine from the grapes because the juice from the beverage just kind of as a byproduct.
00:06:22:14 - 00:06:24:04
Wayne Mulder
Did you try this wine?
00:06:24:06 - 00:06:29:02
Jerrod Hardy
Half. Of course, I had to try it when I'm in Costa Rica and.
00:06:29:04 - 00:06:34:19
Wayne Mulder
What was the flavor profile? I mean, did it have a typical wine taste or. I'm just thinking bitter.
00:06:34:21 - 00:06:46:05
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, you're right. You're right on with that. I would not drink it. Okay. I wouldn't buy it now, but I just thought was cool. They were looking for a way to to not have so much waste associated to processing coffee.
00:06:46:11 - 00:06:47:17
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, I think that's awesome.
00:06:47:17 - 00:06:55:02
Jerrod Hardy
Actually, to seed was like almost a grape type fruit. Random fact. But I got a lot of random facts. Not only that.
00:06:55:05 - 00:07:04:05
Wayne Mulder
I love it. That's going to make this very interesting. What's your favorite or where is your favorite place to have that drink? A place that's peaceful for you?
00:07:04:07 - 00:07:16:01
Jerrod Hardy
Oh man, I, I live on the out of my Airstream full time traveling the country. So my favorite place is right here watching that sunrise come up from my trailer where I'm parked.
00:07:16:03 - 00:07:26:17
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, that's. And we're going to get more into a little bit of that traveling, but that is such a beautiful opportunity. Speaking of traveling, do you have a best or worst travel story?
00:07:26:19 - 00:07:44:23
Jerrod Hardy
I Best or worst? Well, I'll tell you the most recent one. So my wife and I were pulling in. We love camping for free, right? We're like old school campers. Like you go out to the woods and just find a spot. We don't do a lot of campgrounds, so we pull up in a spot outside Alamogordo, New Mexico.
00:07:45:00 - 00:08:02:03
Jerrod Hardy
Beautiful mountains are right there. It's free camping as Bureau of Land Management. We're good to go. I come down a little dirt road and I see something out in front of me. You know, campers are usually pretty respectful. You mind your peace. I mind mine. Every now and then, we'll come on and talk. But we don't go right up on each other.
00:08:02:05 - 00:08:20:00
Jerrod Hardy
Things wave and frantically in the road at me and I. What the hell is going on? So. And that's the only road in to get back where I need to go. So I keep creeping, creeping, get closer and closer. It's a 60 something year old dude in a pink thong bikini that appointed himself camp post and thought I should park right next to him.
00:08:20:00 - 00:08:37:03
Jerrod Hardy
That's the best spot out there. And I feel like now this ain't going to work. But now here's what I'll share with you Way. Okay. Incredible tan line. Saw that old man. He had the best tan I've ever seen. Of course, he's wearing a pink thong bikini, so he's going to work that.
00:08:37:05 - 00:08:43:06
Wayne Mulder
I could see where that would work. Yes. In fact, if I ever want to improve my tan legs, I'll keep that in mind.
00:08:43:06 - 00:08:55:04
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah. And if you're ever out in New Mexico, you're going to stay some Bureau of Land Management property. Read the reviews on compendium so you don't get sidetracked by the pink thong bikini guy.
00:08:55:06 - 00:09:09:01
Wayne Mulder
Okay, I will. This is a good note for everybody listening. I don't even know what to say after that one. Jared Actually, I love that. Do you have a most meaningful modern nonfiction book?
00:09:09:03 - 00:09:14:08
Jerrod Hardy
Hands down, man. I will tell you. Greenlights Matthew McConaughey.
00:09:14:10 - 00:09:19:14
Wayne Mulder
Really? I have yet to read it. I have it on my audible. In all honesty, I have yet to read it or listen.
00:09:19:14 - 00:09:44:23
Jerrod Hardy
To it later. It's sitting right next to me is I read this ten times and I'll just go back to it. Read little snippets. It is a fantastic story of how he became who he is to his family through entertaining stories. And if you're an audible guy, it's super cool to listen now because he actually reads it to you on his accent and his is fun storytelling.
00:09:44:23 - 00:10:00:07
Jerrod Hardy
But yeah, it's it's not a what I I'm not a big Hollywood fan. I don't I don't really look to Hollywood to lead me in much. But that book is it's a very purposeful, well-written book that'll get you thinking as far as entertain. Yeah.
00:10:00:09 - 00:10:10:24
Wayne Mulder
Absolutely. I will. Definitely. I've heard others say that it's good no one that I've had on the show, but just like others in my circle, that I've talked about it. But yeah, I have yet to actually listen to it, so I'll be sure to do that.
00:10:11:01 - 00:10:15:01
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah. No, it's fancy. I won't. I can't recommend high enough.
00:10:15:03 - 00:10:23:20
Wayne Mulder
Similar to the coffee question, what is the place that brings you the most peace? Where is your favorite spot to just stop, breathe and enjoy life?
00:10:23:22 - 00:10:38:11
Jerrod Hardy
Pryor Our property up in Wyoming, we call it Naked Acres because when our family bought it, there was no buildings and it was just a naked 40 acre lot of land. And now we have some cabins, we have a tiny house. Cell phones don't work real well out there.
00:10:38:13 - 00:10:42:16
Wayne Mulder
That's a prerequisite for a good time journey and so forth that work.
00:10:42:18 - 00:10:52:10
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, no, that's the most peaceful like that. And you're you're just immersed in nature. So that would be my my favorite place to go if I just got to sit and unwind.
00:10:52:12 - 00:10:58:07
Wayne Mulder
Now, Naked Acres, that part of Wyoming, does it actually have any trees on this acreage or is it just open.
00:10:58:12 - 00:11:21:15
Jerrod Hardy
You know, where Wyoming gets a bad rap because of kind of people drive through it on I-80, which goes east to west, straight across to the plains, and it's very flat and windy. But we're actually up we're nine miles in from South Dakota. So we're actually in the Black Hills like Sturgis, Devil's Tower. So it's a very spiritual area, very good energies if you're into that stuff.
00:11:21:17 - 00:11:24:14
Jerrod Hardy
But now we have mountains, trees. It's nice.
00:11:24:16 - 00:11:51:17
Wayne Mulder
It's awesome. Yeah, we were talking a little bit about that off line. It is funny you say that when you talk on the south side, they're coming out of like Cheyenne, because when we first the first time we went to Wyoming, first of a couple of trips we've made there, like we were talking about, we stopped at a rest area or not really rest areas is a welcome center When you first come into the state and we were talking to the older couple that was working the desk and one and we would talked about much like you and I did, and it's no secret to my listeners that my intention is to end up in
00:11:51:17 - 00:12:03:01
Wayne Mulder
Wyoming. And we had this conversation and she was like, Yeah, most people only make it like 3 to 4 years, and then they head back because of the wind. Then that southern part of the state that just is relentless.
00:12:03:03 - 00:12:21:12
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, for sure. Yeah. And you know, I raised my family in Fort Collins, Colorado, which is 45 minutes south of Cheyenne, on the same interstate. And the weather difference just in that area is unbelievable. Like in Fort Collins, we'd have 50 degrees and sunny days and shine. I'd be in a blizzard.
00:12:21:14 - 00:12:22:09
Wayne Mulder
Really?
00:12:22:11 - 00:12:30:19
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah. It's just it was high. Like, people don't realize, like, Cheyenne is higher than Denver. Like, it's more than a mile high elevation.
00:12:30:19 - 00:12:31:17
Wayne Mulder
And I realize that.
00:12:31:23 - 00:12:36:02
Jerrod Hardy
Elevation is a ticket, man. You got to pay attention. Your elevation. That's going to tell you a lot about your weather.
00:12:36:07 - 00:12:54:01
Wayne Mulder
Okay. Very good to know. And I like that Fort Collins area. We actually stop there on one of the trips when we were headed back to Denver, because obviously we usually fly in there. Yeah. So all that being said, let's start with your origin story. It's Mustang. You spent a little time in the Air Force as well. So wherever you kind of want to start.
00:12:54:03 - 00:13:10:00
Jerrod Hardy
Huh? Yeah, I did four years in the Air Force. Funny story, dude. It's kind of this. I'll tell you just how I live my life and how I ended up selling all my stuff and living in an Airstream, traveling as I went to college and played baseball. My I had no Plan B my whole life. I will be a professional baseball player.
00:13:10:00 - 00:13:26:14
Jerrod Hardy
That's all I was going to do. My dad was career Air Force, so I grew up on Air Force Base and so I was familiar with that. And then a half way through my sophomore year in junior college, I realized I wasn't good enough. Like, it just hit me like, Man, these guys are just better than me. Like, I'm not playing as much as I wanted.
00:13:26:16 - 00:13:43:02
Jerrod Hardy
I'm just not going to be a pro like that's not my card. So I went to the cafeteria, I ordered lunch, I was sitting there and I was an Air Force recruiter, like couple of tables down, minding his business. I was like, I'm gonna do that. And I just walked down. I was like, Well, how long would it take me to go?
00:13:43:04 - 00:14:02:02
Jerrod Hardy
And he's like, Well, when do you graduate? It's like, Well, how am I to your degree in May? And I want to go right away. Next thing I know, I was taking the test, signed up, was leaving and I just called. My mom was like, Hey, I'm not going be back for summer like I thought I might. She's like, Oh, well, having not played baseball that night, I joined Air Force and now where I was.
00:14:02:04 - 00:14:05:07
Wayne Mulder
You're kind of a spontaneous guy, I'm guessing.
00:14:05:09 - 00:14:22:11
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah. And my wife, I here's what I'll tell you, Wayne, is I don't get paralyzed by analysis. It's a great thing. And that's one of the things I think hinders our society nowadays is we're always looking for more information. I need this to be just right, not to be just right it. And maybe I should do a little more.
00:14:22:13 - 00:14:40:08
Jerrod Hardy
But I'm a leaper. Like I just go because I like to make mistakes and I like to learn. Yeah. And so, yeah, I don't play safe, like real safe or not. So I ended up in the Air Force, and law enforcement was one of my top jobs off the ASVAB test and how they were. I sound like kind of cool.
00:14:40:10 - 00:14:51:16
Jerrod Hardy
That was high, but I wasn't. One of those guys that grew up always wanted to be a cop. I didn't play cops when I was kids. Like it just was like, Hey, they say, I'll be good at this. They must know what I'm supposed to do. So I'll try it.
00:14:51:18 - 00:15:06:17
Wayne Mulder
Very cool. Yeah. I wasn't one of these that grew up saying I was going to be a cop either. In fact, I wasn't. For many years, I was a landscaper. So were you only in the Air Force then? The four years and just one tour of duty and then went into law enforcement.
00:15:06:19 - 00:15:18:04
Jerrod Hardy
Wow. So I went back to college because I was like, Well, maybe I'll try college again. Went back still in my jam, and then a local police department hiring they I and go give this thing a whirl. And then yeah I did 21 years.
00:15:18:06 - 00:15:19:16
Wayne Mulder
Wow that was this out west.
00:15:19:16 - 00:15:30:12
Jerrod Hardy
Also I started in Montana the butte so we're both sheriff's department police department consolidate government. And then I did four years there and then I went to Fort Collins Police in northern Colorado for the last 17.
00:15:30:18 - 00:15:34:15
Wayne Mulder
Bill is a consolidated government like a metro?
00:15:34:17 - 00:15:50:03
Jerrod Hardy
I yeah, I guess, Sheriff. Well, because there's not enough tax base, to be honest. So they don't really support a sheriff's department and a police department and so they consolidated back in the late seventies, I think. So it's a silver ball joint government.
00:15:50:05 - 00:15:52:19
Wayne Mulder
Interesting. That's that's different.
00:15:52:22 - 00:15:54:07
Jerrod Hardy
With you.
00:15:54:09 - 00:16:06:24
Wayne Mulder
Familiar with the area. But what really struck me is that usually when you think of metro governments, it's these giant metro. You know, it's Miami, it's Louisville, it's, you know, these. So to hear that, they consolidated them together, I find interesting.
00:16:07:01 - 00:16:12:19
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah. And that's kind of a thing in Montana, like Anaconda Deer Lodge is consolidated and that's even smaller in view.
00:16:12:21 - 00:16:20:08
Wayne Mulder
Okay. So what kind of roles did you hold throughout your time in law enforcement? I know we all kind of them all sorts things, but.
00:16:20:10 - 00:16:48:10
Jerrod Hardy
So I did opposite Patrol. I was on the SWAT team at both places for a while. I was a school resource officer in Fort Collins and I ran our in-service training for a while and then a job I loved the absolute most, a school resource officer I really liked. And then the last eight years of my career I ran our academy and that's kind of where I found, okay, what am I going to do after police work was through coaching recruits, through their training.
00:16:48:12 - 00:16:57:07
Wayne Mulder
Was your academy that was in Colorado? Yeah. Was your academy agency specific or is it similar to Wyoming where they all go to one post certified.
00:16:57:09 - 00:17:08:14
Jerrod Hardy
Right? Yeah, I know Colorado has a bunch of academies that bigger agencies have their own Fort Collins now has its own. But while I was still there, we were sending them to a state academy down near Denver. And then I got.
00:17:08:14 - 00:17:08:16
Wayne Mulder
A.
00:17:08:16 - 00:17:17:23
Jerrod Hardy
Backside supervisor in there that had come back. And then we do another in-house academy on top of it. So our our training program was almost a full year, including field training.
00:17:18:00 - 00:17:22:22
Wayne Mulder
Wow. Now, they didn't live there, though. That was something where they would just come for, right?
00:17:22:24 - 00:17:25:00
Jerrod Hardy
They commuted back and forth. Yeah.
00:17:25:01 - 00:17:44:14
Wayne Mulder
Okay. Very good. So do you what were your thoughts on training? I'm assuming that probably led to what you're doing now a little bit, right? Yeah, that what were you seeing as some of the big issues or things that we needed to instill in these new recruits, people coming into the profession.
00:17:44:16 - 00:18:08:24
Jerrod Hardy
Coaching, coaching. We weren't coaching them. Right? And so let me tell you that. So one of the goals I set for myself is I love mixed martial arts. And I was older, right? I didn't get into it until my thirties and then I want to fight and I wanted to see if I could do it. So I did my first mixed martial arts fighter at 42 years old and in a cage at a big arena.
00:18:08:24 - 00:18:24:12
Jerrod Hardy
I saw a bunch of tickets raise money for charity. It was super awesome, but that's where it really hit me, where we are dropping the ball, right? And so to get ready for that fight, I knew what weight I had to be. I knew what night the fight was going to take place. I knew what time I'd be get in the cage.
00:18:24:12 - 00:18:47:02
Jerrod Hardy
I knew my opponent. I could look up my opponent. I could see who coached him. I had all this stuff that I knew. Yet I would say 90% of my training with my coach. I was happy. I was fortunate to be with a world champion. That coach me was mental. Yeah, I did my skills, I did my running, I did my jujitsu and wrestling and boxing.
00:18:47:04 - 00:19:05:16
Jerrod Hardy
But then he always coached my mental side and I pushed me to believe and to not want to give up when things got hard, but go further and further. And I started thinking like, wait a second, because I journaled all this and I wrote a nice blog and I would share my stories and I started thinking, Why? Why are we not doing this for cops?
00:19:05:22 - 00:19:19:11
Jerrod Hardy
Like cops don't know when the bad guys is going to be that they don't know how big or small the bad guys are going to be. They don't know what time of day the fight's going to take place, but we just have to know that they have to have this sort of skills, this set of skills at some point in their life.
00:19:19:11 - 00:19:24:11
Jerrod Hardy
They may use it or a lot of cops will go through the whole career and never use it.
00:19:24:13 - 00:19:25:21
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:19:25:23 - 00:19:26:11
Jerrod Hardy
But we.
00:19:26:13 - 00:19:28:03
Wayne Mulder
Thank God. But yeah.
00:19:28:05 - 00:19:50:17
Jerrod Hardy
For sure. But we. But why? Why am I in my police training? My is spending 90% on physical skills, only ten on mindset. But my sport training where there's rules, a referee too could save me. I could tap out whenever I want. I'm not going to die as 90% mental and 10% physical. So that's when I start looking as like, No, I got to change this.
00:19:50:17 - 00:20:09:01
Jerrod Hardy
I'm going to coach cops. Like I would coach fighters and I'm a coach cops to believe in themselves and to believe in their skills and to know the skills work and have answers. Okay, if this doesn't work, I can do this. Not what I saw all around the country, which is more fear based.
00:20:09:03 - 00:20:09:23
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, more.
00:20:09:23 - 00:20:31:21
Jerrod Hardy
Reactionary and all skills, but no heart. Right? Because that's. I need you to perform, right? You need like, my coach needs me to perform that night in a cage to validate him as a coach. And as I was like, Wait, if I take that mindset to police training and when I coach police officers, it's not about checking off.
00:20:31:21 - 00:20:59:13
Jerrod Hardy
Did you get the attendance sheet done? It's not about checking off. Did you see the outline? It's about No, wait a second. When I coach Wayne and six months from now Wayne goes out, uses these skills professionally to tactically within law, policy and ethics, and does a great job. That's how I know I did my job. Yeah, not the outline, it's not the attendance sheet.
00:20:59:15 - 00:21:23:16
Jerrod Hardy
What if I bring that mindset and I was like, You know what? I'm going to start my own company. And again, not a ton of research. I didn't do market analysis, I didn't get angel investors. I was like, No, I just believe I can do this. So in 2016 I put together my team Hardy ground tactics coaching course and started going around the country teaching cops to coach students, not just train them on skills.
00:21:23:18 - 00:21:30:16
Wayne Mulder
Okay, So the mental component of it was there in the training program that you put together.
00:21:30:18 - 00:21:59:23
Jerrod Hardy
For sure. Yeah. So I would say and if you read the reviews of stuff, you'll see like people like, man, the skills are great, but it's the belief. Yeah, it's he believes in us and we believe in ourselves and we believe in our students. It's that the spirit of it is. Is what the difference? Yeah, I would, you know, and, you know, law enforcement right now people people that aren't and a lot of times would be like police need more training and we need more training.
00:21:59:23 - 00:22:04:24
Jerrod Hardy
And I would argue a lot of times we don't need more. We need better.
00:22:05:01 - 00:22:06:06
Wayne Mulder
Interesting.
00:22:06:08 - 00:22:16:21
Jerrod Hardy
Right? We need better training. Training that we believe in, training that presume that gives us the results were after not just that we sit through to say we went through to check off some liability.
00:22:16:23 - 00:22:20:07
Wayne Mulder
Yeah. And sadly we both seen so much of that.
00:22:20:09 - 00:22:32:09
Jerrod Hardy
Because I see that as being driven by people that that aren't after the outcomes. Right. And so that's that was kind of how I started that this whole next venture in life.
00:22:32:11 - 00:22:53:00
Wayne Mulder
I love that phrase that you talk about where you're moving away from fear based training towards confidence based coaching. Can you go a little further into that dichotomy? Because I really think that really struck me when I was prepping for this interview. Yeah, so much of what we do really is based in fact, today my morning roll call was on this idea of don't be safe, right?
00:22:53:00 - 00:23:03:21
Wayne Mulder
It isn't that I don't want people to be safe, but obviously we get so ingrained in this safety focus that it becomes fear based. So I would love to hear a little more of your thoughts on that.
00:23:03:23 - 00:23:22:20
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, I, I listened to it. That was a great, great point. You said, let's quit being safe and let's accept the risk. We have to take a managed risk. Yes, right. And respect and we are so fear adverse, Right. That fear is a bad word. And I'm like, so one of the first talks I do at the class is I'm like fear.
00:23:22:20 - 00:23:37:18
Jerrod Hardy
I put it up on the board. Let's talk about fear. Let's get it out in the open. What are you afraid of today? And I tell them I started, Okay, here's what I'm afraid of. You won't buy into my tactics being you don't mesh. I can't make you better. I let you down. I'm afraid of that. What are you afraid of?
00:23:37:20 - 00:23:47:18
Jerrod Hardy
And everybody talks about their fears. And I'm like, okay, now that they're on the board, we all got them in open and we see that we all have the same fears. Let's coach Tom, Let's make ourselves better.
00:23:47:20 - 00:23:48:22
Wayne Mulder
I love that guy.
00:23:48:24 - 00:24:08:14
Jerrod Hardy
Because why Everybody comes to a class with fear and is the funny thing about cops is what are they fear most? They don't fear bad guys. They don't fear suspects on the street. Most of the time they fear each other. They fear judgment. They fear failure. They fear getting hurt. So let's put it out in the open and you'll say, Oh, I'm not the only one.
00:24:08:16 - 00:24:10:21
Wayne Mulder
By one. They fear talking.
00:24:10:23 - 00:24:30:18
Jerrod Hardy
Right? So now you can talk about it now. Now Wayne is comfortable. Say, Hey, Coach, I was afraid of this. I'll call. Guess what? Eight other people are afraid of it, too. Let's talk about Are you afraid of getting taken tonight to the ground and get your gun. Take away her outfit. I'm gonna give you two or three techniques that if you get taken to the ground, you retain your weapon.
00:24:30:20 - 00:24:45:01
Jerrod Hardy
You know, I mean, like, instead of being afraid of that and saying, like, oh, if this happens, it's really, really bad. Like, you know, the odds are you're going to die. No, no, I don't want to teach that. If that's the odds, what are the odds that I'm going to win and that's what I'm going to teach?
00:24:45:03 - 00:24:45:18
Wayne Mulder
I love that.
00:24:45:18 - 00:25:01:10
Jerrod Hardy
That's what I want to believe in. And and, you know, I mean, here's a story I'll tell you is and this is the one where I was like, okay, I know what I'm doing is working because I talk about coaching and I talk about believing and I talk about inspiring. And there's a lot of cops out there that are too tough.
00:25:01:10 - 00:25:09:15
Jerrod Hardy
They're hard, right? They were cynical. And I got I don't work like it's not going to work. You know, I don't need to believe anymore. Here's my story of how I know this works.
00:25:09:15 - 00:25:11:12
Wayne Mulder
Lame cut.
00:25:11:14 - 00:25:36:00
Jerrod Hardy
We had I was I went to a state academy to supervise the recruits I had down there. I had seven at the time. Three were females. They're doing ground tactics at the state level, which is a little different. Where I teach, it's a little more watered down. It's an academy, right? So I watch and I watch as they break in the class goes and there's two instructors for about 40 students, terrible ratio, which is traditional.
00:25:36:02 - 00:25:57:05
Jerrod Hardy
And I watch as often one side, the guys that are really into this get gone and they're going hard way too fast for the skill level. And I watched that my three lady officers go to the other corner with another group of lady officers from other agencies, and they're not really doing much. And I watch one of the instructors go, Well, where do the instructors go there?
00:25:57:07 - 00:25:59:12
Wayne Mulder
Over well over, helping them.
00:25:59:14 - 00:26:14:20
Jerrod Hardy
Over to the guys, right? Because the guys are getting it. They're slow and they're after it. And my ladies are doing a rapport, too, and they're looking around. I don't know. I do it right. I don't know. So I just go interrupt the go. Hey, can I work with the ladies? You teach whatever you want. I will teach what you teach.
00:26:14:20 - 00:26:31:04
Jerrod Hardy
But I'm going to take the ladies. And on my way, I'm going to just coach them. So I do it one day, a couple of years. Lady. One of the couple of years later, one of the lady officers decides to come to our agency from her, from the agency she was with. I get assigned her background. I know a little bit.
00:26:31:06 - 00:26:56:01
Jerrod Hardy
Do her background. Nothing spectacular. I think we get along fine. Well, then she comes to our training program. I coach like I coach, everybody get to go. Two years later, she's driving on a call and she sees a neighboring agency, a university cop pulled over on the side Reuters lights going where she shouldn't be there. So she slows down.
00:26:56:01 - 00:27:19:16
Jerrod Hardy
She's running coach on call, she slows down, looks over, he's retreating backwards. And there's a lady with a knife coming after him. She spends her car around parks between them, jumps out tactically, moves towards him, shoots, puts rounds on target of the person with a knife. By about 4:00 in the morning, I got a call from her as well.
00:27:19:16 - 00:27:31:08
Jerrod Hardy
She says, Wayne, here's what she tells me. She says, Jared, I just want to thank you for all your coaching. It was your voice I heard step by step through that process.
00:27:31:10 - 00:27:32:03
Wayne Mulder
Wow.
00:27:32:05 - 00:27:40:19
Jerrod Hardy
Now, now, now, here's where it gets good. Well, here's how I know coaching cops works. Guess what? I never taught her.
00:27:40:21 - 00:27:44:11
Wayne Mulder
Anything to do with actually returning fire.
00:27:44:13 - 00:27:52:24
Jerrod Hardy
I never spent one single solitary second anywhere near her on a shooting range. Never. Yeah, Because you.
00:27:52:24 - 00:27:55:02
Wayne Mulder
Mentioned you were in a gym. I didn't think you did.
00:27:55:04 - 00:28:19:12
Jerrod Hardy
I didn't teach her driving. I didn't teach a call response. I taught her defense. I taught her to win her fight with her hands and to be slick. Yeah. And to believe in herself. So in the moment of truth, where she's saving a life, she's not here in the firearms coach or the driving instructor, she hurt me because I helped her start to believe in herself.
00:28:19:14 - 00:28:37:09
Jerrod Hardy
So when people tell me, like cops need tough training and any hard training, I a lot of times I say, No, wait a second. We need to get to cops hearts again. Yeah, and their minds, the skills are there. We just got to get them to believe in themselves and to believe that we're teaching real skills.
00:28:37:11 - 00:29:13:00
Wayne Mulder
Absolutely. That is a powerful, powerful story. And I would think that maybe one of the key elements of it and this is just my anecdotal thoughts on it, but because of the role that mindset takes in these types of incidents, whether we're talking going hands on or shooting and so forth, by you coaching to that environment, I mean, I guess what I'm likening it to is, you know, whenever whenever you go to any of these mindset type classes or whatever, it's all about that almost centering effect, that ability to breathe in the moment, you know, when the world is chaos around you.
00:29:13:02 - 00:29:31:09
Wayne Mulder
And I really think by focusing on that, it helps in all areas of life. It doesn't specifically have to be a use of force incident. It doesn't have to be a shooting. But that ability that she was able to get from your class, where she was able to calm down in that moment and just make, you know, just really default to her training.
00:29:31:11 - 00:29:32:13
Jerrod Hardy
But absolutely all.
00:29:32:13 - 00:29:34:05
Wayne Mulder
Came down to mindset.
00:29:34:07 - 00:30:02:13
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, 100% right. But it goes just like you said, Wayne you can't coach somebody to believe themselves and training and that belief doesn't carry over to her life. Yeah right You can't coach stant to see opportunity and then they don't go home It's the opportunity for their kids right Like that's right. I'm saying like when we get a chance to train police officers, we're training their families.
00:30:02:15 - 00:30:05:05
Jerrod Hardy
We're. We're trying to make them better people.
00:30:05:07 - 00:30:06:12
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:30:06:14 - 00:30:19:20
Jerrod Hardy
Right. Because we all know that divorce rates ridiculous. Alcoholism is ridiculous. Suicide, Ridiculous. Why is that? Because we spend so much time on techniques and tactics and things and not enough time on people's hearts.
00:30:19:22 - 00:30:23:11
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, I would agree 100%.
00:30:23:13 - 00:30:42:12
Jerrod Hardy
That's what I like to do, man. Like, I like to have real conversations and challenge police stereotypes, police mythology and ideas that that we can only be police officers because there's so much more to us. There was there was more to you before you got that job. There should definitely be a lot, too, when you leave that job.
00:30:42:14 - 00:31:04:07
Wayne Mulder
And I would even argue that a lot of your best law enforcement officers are the ones that take those skill sets and who they were before the job and implement them into this career. You know, I know when I first came in this career, I kind of felt like because a lot of the guys that were coming through the academy with me were guys that had military experience or they had had and they had all these life skills.
00:31:04:07 - 00:31:27:02
Wayne Mulder
And most of mine had been service based. I had worked at K-Mart when I was quite young, ran a landscape company and so forth. What I didn't realize then, it wasn't till I went to the academy that those soft skills, that ability to communicate with people, to work in a service based environment are absolutely what makes some of the best law enforcement officers, because they understand that essential part of working with people.
00:31:27:02 - 00:31:38:09
Wayne Mulder
But then even like you're saying, that internal ability to, you know, a high emotional intelligence also plays a big role in their success in this career.
00:31:38:11 - 00:31:45:17
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, absolutely. And that's a man I think that's important nowadays that when we hire people, we hire them from all walks of life.
00:31:45:19 - 00:31:46:15
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:31:46:17 - 00:32:07:20
Jerrod Hardy
Right. And not just a certain. This is our stereotypical. This is the recruit we want. We need to hire across the board. Because you're absolutely right. And I would always say this, you know, give me a sandwich artist, a subway. They can become a police officer if they're good at interpersonal communication, handling conflict, multitasking, following orders, showing right.
00:32:07:20 - 00:32:10:18
Jerrod Hardy
Like their skills there that I can work with.
00:32:10:20 - 00:32:33:03
Wayne Mulder
Absolutely. And in some ways, I think what like you said, I think that pulling from all these various areas is what makes forces strong because they really are or should be a picture of the community in which they serve for from the standpoint of differences of opinions and, yes, life experiences, the more that you have, the stronger the unit's going to be.
00:32:33:03 - 00:32:38:07
Wayne Mulder
I don't want an entire agency of people like me. Nobody wants that.
00:32:38:09 - 00:32:57:07
Jerrod Hardy
But see, now here's the here's the flip, Scott. Here's the flip side to that. When we say we want to recruit across the community lines, like all all different people should be able to come into our agency. But then what is the habit we have? What do we tend to do when we get them in the doors?
00:32:57:09 - 00:33:00:22
Wayne Mulder
Well, we do essentially boil them like.
00:33:00:24 - 00:33:02:08
Jerrod Hardy
We boss me.
00:33:02:10 - 00:33:05:20
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, this is how we want you. You've got to fit within this box, right?
00:33:05:21 - 00:33:25:24
Jerrod Hardy
Was the last time you got approached within the agency to be like, Hey, I want you get creative for a second problem. Solve this. Hey, I saw your background and this. Think outside police work and give me an idea on this. Like we It's so funny, right? And that used to drive me nuts when we'd recruit these people and.
00:33:26:01 - 00:33:46:04
Jerrod Hardy
And then you check on them two years down the road, and their shift supervisor wants them all doing the same thing. So many take it so many call like we want everybody to be the same. Yeah, right. Like that's part of, I think, the evolution of law enforcement that we could learn better from small business as managing our talent a little better.
00:33:46:06 - 00:33:53:04
Jerrod Hardy
Right? Not every cop has to be exactly the same. It's that uniqueness that makes us better.
00:33:53:06 - 00:34:28:09
Wayne Mulder
Absolutely. I mean, we all like the statement, you know, 100 years of tradition uninterrupted by progress, which very much is law enforcement. However, do you think that's a leadership failure, what you're describing? Because I would think that they answer to that not only lies in the culture of the agency as a whole, but in light. So just last week I was an FBI lead in classes and this was kind of one of the conversations that was bouncing around is, you know, really those front frontline sergeants and corporals are where these kind of things start, like when you talk about thinking outside the box.
00:34:28:09 - 00:34:50:19
Wayne Mulder
And because a lot of times you get these guys in that role that and we're fortunately seeing a change. But 1015 years and they're cynical and you know, the agency's out to get me kind of thinking. And then that is the ones where you're seeing where they're creating these boxes for those under their command. So would you agree that that is a leadership issue or do you think it's a culture issue or what do you think?
00:34:50:21 - 00:35:07:09
Jerrod Hardy
I think it goes back to your roll call today being safe. If I'm leading people and my only goal is to not get in trouble by the person above me, my only goal is to not disrupt them.
00:35:07:11 - 00:35:07:24
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:35:08:01 - 00:35:19:15
Jerrod Hardy
While I lead with fear, right? I lead with I don't want to get any questions asked of be out there. So I want you guys to just play it safe down here. Right. Like I think the fear.
00:35:19:17 - 00:35:20:17
Wayne Mulder
Yep.
00:35:20:19 - 00:35:48:11
Jerrod Hardy
Manifests itself in so many ways, but within leadership, it really hinders creativity, it hinders problem solving and progress. So I would say it's the same thing that we've been talking about and that we are so risk averse, we are so negative media attention. We're so afraid of getting something wrong that we'd play it so safe. And then nobody thrives, right?
00:35:48:11 - 00:36:01:22
Jerrod Hardy
Nobody's nobody's challenged. Right. Well, sorry about that. Talk about why do police officers get disgruntled? Why do police officers tend to become cynical? Yeah, I was there. A lot of times we're not challenging them.
00:36:02:02 - 00:36:12:19
Wayne Mulder
Right. They don't or they don't feel like their voice holds any weight or any they get a vote in anything which is very much in line with what you're describing. It's that whole risk averse thinking.
00:36:12:21 - 00:36:36:11
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, absolutely right. And it's I think that permeates a lot of our society professionally parenting. If we'll go if I'll leave our law enforcement job to pursue our true passion, we're just very risk averse right now. We we try to hide from as much risk as possible when the reality is law for us is a very risky business and it needs courageous people.
00:36:36:17 - 00:36:37:16
Wayne Mulder
Yes. Amen.
00:36:37:18 - 00:36:42:03
Jerrod Hardy
Right. I need courageous leaders and courageous followers.
00:36:42:05 - 00:37:02:20
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, I would agree with that 100%. Let me ask you, kind of continuing down this road just one step further. You talk a little bit about training that is tailored to the political climate that we're currently in. Is that kind of very much in line with what we're talking about here, or do you go a different step when you talk about tailoring it to the political climate?
00:37:02:22 - 00:37:04:15
Jerrod Hardy
Like for my training, yeah.
00:37:04:17 - 00:37:13:06
Wayne Mulder
So one of the videos I came across that you were talking about, you were talking about having the training tailored specifically to the political climate. What do you mean by that?
00:37:13:08 - 00:37:17:23
Jerrod Hardy
Well, what I mean by that is like Colorado has a bunch of goofy Senate bills.
00:37:18:00 - 00:37:19:16
Wayne Mulder
It's got a bunch of goofy bills in general.
00:37:19:22 - 00:37:23:21
Jerrod Hardy
That just came out. So cops can't have hands anywhere near next.
00:37:23:23 - 00:37:24:13
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, it's.
00:37:24:13 - 00:37:45:05
Jerrod Hardy
A choking, even though they're not that most of the time they're not choking. So like, I what I can say is I'll bring ground tactics skills to that. Keep your hands away from a neck, but let you escape. Right? Like that's what I'm saying. I'm tailor. Like, I'll tailor to whatever limits you have got Taylor to. If you if you only have 4 hours of in-service training for a year, let's let's make a really good training.
00:37:45:07 - 00:37:45:22
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:37:45:24 - 00:38:11:01
Jerrod Hardy
Right. I don't. Here's ultimately what you said it this morning when I listen to your show, the community wants I'm a sort of word that people are like, Oh, you can't say that word anymore. And I call bullshit. The community wants warriors as police officers. Yes, right. What is a warrior? A warrior is physically prepared, mentally sharp for battle, has the tools and the confidence.
00:38:11:03 - 00:38:15:10
Jerrod Hardy
But a warrior also protects their flock. They protect the people.
00:38:15:12 - 00:38:16:00
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:38:16:02 - 00:38:27:11
Jerrod Hardy
Right. Nobody wants to call the cops down. I'm a want at three in the morning and have some cops show up that's asking them questions about what they should do that's unsure of themselves that their training.
00:38:27:13 - 00:38:28:06
Wayne Mulder
Yep.
00:38:28:08 - 00:38:42:09
Jerrod Hardy
Right. But that's, that's what we're doing. We're more doubt through a lot of our training. We're creating training scars of so much liability and paperwork and oh my God, all this. And that has happened to this happen. So now I don't even want to do it.
00:38:42:11 - 00:38:43:06
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:38:43:08 - 00:39:10:18
Jerrod Hardy
That, that we're losing the point of when the community calls us. They should know we're ready. And that means we're ready for everything. We're ready to serve, to listen, to solve problems. We're also ready to win fights if that's what it takes. Absolutely right. And we can't be so soft that we have none of these skills or that we're so specialized right?
00:39:10:20 - 00:39:31:19
Wayne Mulder
Yeah. No, it's it's huge. And it is like you said, you just say the word like warrior and people roll their eyes. But at the end of the day, that's what they want. I mean, it was kind of that illustration that I have. I don't remember if I'd gotten it from Wild at Heart or some organization, but that whole statement about, you know, you castrate the gelding but didn't be fruitful.
00:39:31:21 - 00:39:49:13
Wayne Mulder
But it's true. You know, we want we wanted the safe, gentle animal, but we want the benefits that come from the stallion. And the same is true in any of these other metaphors, whether we're talking sheep dogs or we're talking, you know, whatever metaphor you want to use. And yes, sadly, I think people yearn for it, seeing it, right.
00:39:49:13 - 00:40:06:19
Wayne Mulder
Like people want authentic masculinity. And I'm not talking, you know, the the negative stereotypes of masculinity. I'm talking about authentic masculinity and, you know, the difference. So, yeah, I think that there's a huge point here that people want it, but people are scared to articulate it. But go on.
00:40:06:21 - 00:40:28:04
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, now you're absolutely right. Here's what I'll tell you is in my classes on the mats right as we go three days to get certified to coach and it's a hard three days. We work out a lot. We learn a lot of good techniques, us tough and we train hard because police work should require sweat. Police work should require a challenge.
00:40:28:07 - 00:40:47:18
Jerrod Hardy
If I go to training and I don't break a sweat and I just spent 4 hours learning how to fight the most violent people in our society. Yeah, but I didn't sweat. I didn't maybe get my heart rate up to the oh, I got to get back in shape a little bit. I didn't realize that I'm lying to you right?
00:40:47:20 - 00:41:06:10
Jerrod Hardy
I'm not training you. I'm checking boxes. So I push people. I will make you better because we're going to sweat. Some are. You're going to puke. I love. I just got an email from a guy that registered again for his second time in this coming spring and he's like, Coach, I promise I'll bring an extra shower in case I puked this year.
00:41:06:12 - 00:41:26:12
Jerrod Hardy
I'm like, Dude, I'm down with it because why? Why is he coming back and to actually make him work? Yeah, but here's what I'll tell you when we end on that Friday afternoon, our last talk is when I call BS My Brother's Keeper and we talk about what does that truly mean? It means here's a here's a four letter word.
00:41:26:12 - 00:41:48:01
Jerrod Hardy
You don't hear a lot that I think should be a more police training. We love each other. And because I love you, I say, Hey, Wayne, I noticed you haven't shown up to work out in the last four months. What's going on, buddy? Or Hey, I'm going to have real conversations with you. Yeah, I'm actually going to not let you isolate yourself to where none of us want to talk to anymore.
00:41:48:01 - 00:42:13:11
Jerrod Hardy
But I'm asking to pull you back into the fold. Go. Hey, Wayne, what's going on? Let's talk. Right, Because the skills are great. Caring about each other, truly actually caring about one another. Who's about who's willing to die alongside you. Yet we tease them because they say this instead of that in the reports, we make fun of them for this mistake they made as a rookie.
00:42:13:11 - 00:42:30:07
Jerrod Hardy
And now here it is 15 years later, and I still can't get rid of that nickname that eats at them. Right? Like we can be better. And that's why that's what I love. Wayne is my program and hanging out with me and coming to these classes. I don't need nobody else to change. I don't need the president to change.
00:42:30:07 - 00:42:47:08
Jerrod Hardy
I don't care who's in office. I don't care what Senate bill is. They right? Because if we decide to believe in ourselves and believe in those around us and truly care within our organizations, law enforcement would be much better regardless of what those people do.
00:42:47:10 - 00:43:16:00
Wayne Mulder
Oh, you are so right. It's funny or interesting, I guess would be a better word. When I was in that training last week that I was referring to the FBI leader classes, one of the things that so this was primarily supervisor, so sergeant and above for the most part, there may have been a couple of exceptions, but every one that I was aware of was either a sergeant on up to captain and the people that were in, everyone would talk about their favorite or their most meaningful and supervisors that they've had throughout their career.
00:43:16:00 - 00:43:39:10
Wayne Mulder
And it always came down to the point that you're making right there. It always came down to someone who they knew cared about them. But then what's interesting is when you flip that coin on the other side, you know, how often are we being the ones that are making sure that that is how those under our command and those that we're working with feel that way and expanding it to just those in our circle, those we work with may be, you know, of equal rank.
00:43:39:12 - 00:44:00:03
Wayne Mulder
How important is this when we talk about mental health and, you know, in stopping the stigma and smashing the stigma and all of this very important stuff that's literally could save lives comes down to what you just said. It's this whole idea of Brother's Keeper loving somebody in the sense that I genuinely care about you and I'm going to prefer you more than myself.
00:44:00:05 - 00:44:15:17
Wayne Mulder
And what can I do to lift you up? I mean, it's so powerful. What do you think are the barriers to it? What do you think? Why do you think it is it more than Norm and rather it's more the exception at this point?
00:44:15:19 - 00:44:48:16
Jerrod Hardy
I think that's interesting. I'll tell you my career. So I started law enforcement in 1997 and I saw a huge shift after September 11th, 2001. Yeah. And, you know, NYPD certainly deservedly stepped to the forefront as national leaders in policing. Right. Based on the heroic actions of the law enforcement and fire departments at that time. But the negative that I saw that came as NYPD was huge on CompStat and statistics.
00:44:48:18 - 00:45:08:15
Jerrod Hardy
Remember, they were coming off the eighties, you know, with the crack and knives of crack cocaine and crime. And they had really ramped down on crack on crime. And it was all data. You remember like Bernard Kerik was on all the national TV shows, and he would talk about, we have these meetings. And if this lieutenant shift has more burglaries than this lieutenant were replacing them.
00:45:08:17 - 00:45:27:08
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, well, that's that's to me where it changed right here. Here's the example. I would share with any leadership I speak to as you and I go on a call. Our wore the same shift when we worked the same shift and you go on a call of a 16 year old out of control. Parents just need parenting advice.
00:45:27:10 - 00:45:45:18
Jerrod Hardy
You raise kids, man, you got this. You go and you spend a good hour and you talk to the parents about some tips. You give them resources in your community. You let them know, Man, I've been there. Let me tell you what worked for me. You talk to the 16 year old, go, Hey, I've been there, too, and I fought with my parents and I know what you're going through, right?
00:45:45:21 - 00:46:03:02
Jerrod Hardy
You spend an hour and at the end of the hour, that family loves you because you gave them time, but not our way. And that hour I wrote for speeding tickets. I didn't take the time to know nobody. I wrote him and cut him, wrote him and cut him as fast as I can. Okay. That's the last hour shift.
00:46:03:03 - 00:46:22:11
Jerrod Hardy
So now we go back to our headquarters or office. Wherever you go to turn in your paperwork, how you do it. And the sarge is there, right? And the sarge sees me. I got four tickets for pissed off people that are going to call him in the morning before tickets. You got nothing but you got a family. This happy that had results.
00:46:22:13 - 00:46:30:21
Jerrod Hardy
That is like, man, where is the kind of cop we need more of? Yeah. Oh, so externally, the community. Who do they want? Me. Are you. They want you?
00:46:31:02 - 00:46:31:20
Wayne Mulder
Yup.
00:46:31:22 - 00:46:36:16
Jerrod Hardy
But as soon as we walk in the door and I got my four tickets internally, who's being rewarded?
00:46:36:18 - 00:46:38:20
Wayne Mulder
Yep. The one who has the stat.
00:46:38:22 - 00:46:58:05
Jerrod Hardy
Me. Even though I didn't provide the very service we said we were going to provide. That's to me what started changing. We became about numbers and response times and cut minutes off of this. And can I, can I put two more people here to make that right? They we start we're playing pieces. We're things.
00:46:58:07 - 00:46:58:23
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, we.
00:46:58:23 - 00:47:15:23
Jerrod Hardy
Lost humanity of the people behind the badge right when I should if I, if I get to lead you, I should probably know. Hey, how old are your kids? What's your wife do? Like I should know more than just you. Yes, because I impact your entire family.
00:47:16:00 - 00:47:38:22
Wayne Mulder
Wow. So that is probably one of the best illustrations and conversation or conversation pieces that I've had around what you just explained. There is exactly the disconnect when people when I say people, when administrators are like, we really want to be behavioral health focused. We want to have a behavioral health unit. We want to deal with people in mental health crisis.
00:47:38:24 - 00:47:59:19
Wayne Mulder
But that misunderstanding is exactly the issue, because oftentimes what makes those units work is time. They're down to your how long can you spend? And I get it. If it's your frontline patrol that's going out there, you may only have two or three guys on the road. Like there can be issues. And I see the bigger picture as well.
00:47:59:19 - 00:48:21:12
Wayne Mulder
But what you described is exactly it. It's kind of the disconnect between what we say we want, which is that that approach, that relationship approach, I guess, is the way to put it, as opposed to that statistic approach, which, like you said, upsets people. They're those people that got the four tickets are the ones that are always commenting on my social media, as I'm sure they probably are yours as well.
00:48:21:12 - 00:48:41:10
Wayne Mulder
So yeah, I really that's why I want the best descriptions and I encourage anyone that's listening to this podcast, especially if you're in an admin role that really describes well that disconnect between what is required if we're really going to go into some of these behavioral health, mental health focused approaches to law enforcement. So I love that.
00:48:41:10 - 00:48:56:07
Jerrod Hardy
Jared Well, thank you. And I would just add one thing. Who is caught in the middle the line level officers, because I'm damned if I do, I'm damned if I if I don't spend the time on the community side there. Matt I'm not I don't have the relationship there.
00:48:56:07 - 00:48:57:21
Wayne Mulder
Matt Yeah.
00:48:57:23 - 00:49:12:18
Jerrod Hardy
But if I spent too much time over there, I don't have the stats and I'm getting pressure from inside the agency, so I'm caught in the middle of, okay, which way do I go here? And that that's, you know, as we talk about going back to relationship building, yes, you're right. That's a big thing around the nation. Right?
00:49:12:18 - 00:49:35:07
Jerrod Hardy
Mental health teams and taking time to talk suicide to people out and stuff, We got to make sure that what we're putting out message wise externally is reinforced behaviorally inside the agency because it's fair to continue to put the cops in between the two to where they can't win. That can't win within a community. I can't win with my agency.
00:49:35:09 - 00:49:40:20
Jerrod Hardy
Right. And that that's where you get that disgruntlement that cynical ism to the turnover rate.
00:49:40:22 - 00:49:53:05
Wayne Mulder
Yep. They feel they can't win so they just it's human nature. If I feel like I can't please anybody, that I'm just going to stop, I'm going to just be like, you know what? The heck with both of you. Then, you know, or whatever the situation may be.
00:49:53:07 - 00:50:11:07
Jerrod Hardy
Which is what we see, right? Why is, you know, a lot of places climb, crime rates are rising. But what is that? What? Cops aren't taking proactive chances anymore. We've legislated down proactive policing to where our like why would I in Colorado go out and contact somebody that might be up to no good?
00:50:11:09 - 00:50:11:24
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:50:12:01 - 00:50:24:14
Jerrod Hardy
And risk my own financial well-being because I don't know if you've seen one of the Senate bills in Colorado is officers can be responsible for I think the first $20,000 personally of any wrongful lawsuit.
00:50:24:16 - 00:50:33:11
Wayne Mulder
Was about to ask I I'm in my correct in saying Colorado was one of them that did away with qualified immunity as well that was.
00:50:33:13 - 00:50:36:16
Jerrod Hardy
They they they they still have it but they changed the language of.
00:50:36:16 - 00:50:37:16
Wayne Mulder
It. Okay.
00:50:37:18 - 00:50:52:18
Jerrod Hardy
So a lot more risk on individual officers now, more more liability while right. So why why you know, if I'm not supported inside my agency now, maybe I'm going to look for a new career. Maybe I'm going to start looking to a new state.
00:50:52:20 - 00:50:53:12
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:50:53:14 - 00:51:08:04
Jerrod Hardy
And so I and I don't say that to scare people like I love law enforcement. It's been great for me and my family. But what I guess what I'd say to to wrap all that up is, is nobody else's job to change our profession if we won't change it within ourselves.
00:51:08:06 - 00:51:09:10
Wayne Mulder
That is well-said.
00:51:09:12 - 00:51:23:02
Jerrod Hardy
Right? It doesn't matter which president we have, which party is in power, who wins the Senate race when they finally count the vote, Who wins, whatever. If we are the same inside to our own agency, nothing's changing.
00:51:23:04 - 00:51:46:12
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, no, I think that's good. And I think like all the points that we've touched on, you know, we've stronger leadership dealing with stronger interpersonal relationships and truly caring about the people we work with, caring about the communities we serve, all those, like you said, if we make those the focus, then it changes everything for the career. Let's since we're getting a little short on time here, let's switch gears to what you've been doing.
00:51:46:13 - 00:52:03:16
Wayne Mulder
Obviously, the listeners are going to be able to put together that you are a great public speaker and stuff. Italy have a podcast, but tell us a little bit about that. I'd also like to know a little bit more. We keep talking about the training you do. Is that on site? Explain that a little bit as well. Yeah.
00:52:03:17 - 00:52:27:24
Jerrod Hardy
So no, I travel the country, training agencies will bring me in and then we'll open it up to surrounding agencies. And I really I niche down. I only focus on the ground tactics. I call it ground tactics because I believe cops should be ground fighting in any facet of the world. Right. We're tacticians means if we get stuck on the ground, we should be able to utilize our options, firearms or C, tase whatever.
00:52:28:01 - 00:52:41:17
Jerrod Hardy
We're tactically sound right? We're making decisions based on what's taking place. So I have a coaching program. I'll come in and are three days long. People get certified to teach my program to their agency.
00:52:41:19 - 00:52:42:13
Wayne Mulder
Okay.
00:52:42:15 - 00:53:12:06
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah. So we've been doing that since 2016. It's super awesome. I mean, I just love the relationships that I have with the coaches around the country. And then this year in 2023, we're launching a new program called The Tactician, which is for smaller rural agencies that maybe don't have the training staff to send to get certified to coach, but they want the training will actually bring I'll come in and bring a couple of my coaches with us and we'll provide the training to the agency at the line level.
00:53:12:08 - 00:53:16:12
Wayne Mulder
Oh, okay. And then your other one is more of like a training the trainer kind of thing is.
00:53:16:13 - 00:53:36:11
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, it's a certification program. Yeah. So I like to think of it as train a trainer, defensive tactics, field training, all coming together because I, they, they learn how to coach, they learn how to give feedback and they learn how to do the skill. So in those three days, basically I'll teach them how to do, say, a weapon retention technique.
00:53:36:13 - 00:53:51:03
Jerrod Hardy
They'll wrap it out as students and then we'll come back. And I said, Now I teach you how you coach this. And then they go out in small groups and actually coach each other for a while, and then they deliver feedback because the ultimate goal is they go back to their agency and they coach their officers on how to.
00:53:51:03 - 00:53:56:11
Jerrod Hardy
Now I do the program, but the skills and beliefs that go behind it, the mindset.
00:53:56:13 - 00:54:04:12
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, that's awesome. Let me add as we segue into your podcast and our thing you've got going on, what does living on purpose mean?
00:54:04:12 - 00:54:33:24
Jerrod Hardy
Do you know what the hell I'm doing, why I'm doing it, and what it's all for? Right? I'm shocked at how many people don't have the results they want in life. But when you ask what you really want, well, I don't know. Why not? How are you going to get it if you don't know, Right? Like I have a clear purpose, as you know, I don't know how far back you want to go, but my mom had me when she was 16 and a lot of people said she she shouldn't keep me at abortion, adoption, all the cases.
00:54:33:24 - 00:54:57:01
Jerrod Hardy
And my mom kept me and me and my mom been very close my whole life. And one of my favorite childhood memories was being in a room. And I had a bunch of there's a bunch of birthday cakes there and I don't know, I just remember has a great birth. I had all these cakes and I want to much later my adult life I asked, my mom was like, Hey, tell me, why did I have so many cakes that year?
00:54:57:03 - 00:55:17:13
Jerrod Hardy
She's like, Well, you were in the bed class with me and all these single moms made you cake, right? I was going to school with my mom. So. So my purpose is this way. I have to do something every day that my mom didn't get to do because she chose to keep me, because she kept me. Her life was drastically different.
00:55:17:13 - 00:55:31:21
Jerrod Hardy
Maybe the life she thought she was going to have. So that means my purpose is to do something that she didn't get to do at the end of her time. When I sit and I go, Mom, you know, you can go to a life. So I got life she never regrets.
00:55:31:23 - 00:55:32:17
Wayne Mulder
Wow.
00:55:32:19 - 00:55:48:00
Jerrod Hardy
Well, you got to have a purpose, right? And so so that's how the On Purpose podcast came up. Ironically, some of my cop friends were like, Hey, dude, you're not going to be here to teach classes anymore. And like, because I did a lot of leadership speaking and stuff. And then how do we hear you create a podcast?
00:55:48:01 - 00:56:05:14
Jerrod Hardy
I was like, All right. And I just kind of I live where I think I'll create a podcast, and now here it is coming four years later, almost 200 episodes just like you. I just it's all about living with purpose. I share stories of people that have found purpose and how they got to it, what they're doing to live within it and how do they share.
00:56:05:14 - 00:56:06:19
Jerrod Hardy
It's a world.
00:56:06:21 - 00:56:22:18
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, no, and it's it's great. And definitely I want the listeners check it out, which of course I have all that in the show notes. Thank you. And one other quick thing I just want to touch on is your book, because I haven't had a chance to read it, but I love the name of it. Extraordinary people in ordinary places.
00:56:22:20 - 00:56:23:06
Jerrod Hardy
Thank you.
00:56:23:07 - 00:56:27:04
Wayne Mulder
What can they expect out of that?
00:56:27:06 - 00:56:55:06
Jerrod Hardy
Well, it's funny you say that because you're an audible guy. I'm literally just finished doing it to Audible. It's been out written format for three years, and so I just finished an audible. So my goal is to have it ready for Audible by the holidays. What do you expect is it's just this is it is extraordinary people and ordinary places that impact on my life, how they impacted it and questions at the end of each chapter to get you reflecting on it.
00:56:55:06 - 00:57:20:23
Jerrod Hardy
Wait a second. There's somebody like that in my life and just like you talked about, was your your dad's episode Like if you're lucky enough to save your parents alive, maybe a chemical, maybe to say, I love you one more time. Right. And it's stuff like that because I wasn't the best kid growing up. And there's a lot of places in my life I could have took different turns if ordinary people that played an extraordinary role and guide me.
00:57:21:03 - 00:57:23:23
Jerrod Hardy
And that's kind of I just wanted to share that as a tribute to them.
00:57:24:00 - 00:57:34:04
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, well, that's what I love about and I saw that as a collection of short stories, and I definitely want encourage the listeners check it out. And I may wait for the Audible book, but I will definitely check it out.
00:57:34:06 - 00:57:52:22
Jerrod Hardy
Yeah, the book was fine because I did like bonus stuff that I couldn't write, really put it in a book. So like at the end of each chapter I do like a bonus. I'm like, Well, there's more to the story. Like, here's something additional details. And, and it's funny though, like, here's what I would tell you, Wayne. As I took no formal writing classes, like, you know, I have a junior college degree.
00:57:52:22 - 00:58:06:17
Jerrod Hardy
I'm not the smartest guy in the world by any means. So when I read my own book back, I'm like, Oh, I can. I wrote that so much better. I just said, This is different, but you don't have to wait to be perfect to get move in in life.
00:58:06:19 - 00:58:08:00
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:58:08:02 - 00:58:10:22
Jerrod Hardy
You know, and it's you just got to go sometimes.
00:58:10:24 - 00:58:25:19
Wayne Mulder
Which is a powerful lesson and really for the last hour that I've got to sit here with you, that's probably the biggest takeaway that I've taken and I hope the listeners do as well, because I am a now a paralysis by analysis guy all day long. I try to fight it, but I am sorry.
00:58:25:19 - 00:58:35:21
Jerrod Hardy
So what you took away from it is that this guy's completely average. I can do it. That's a great message. I get asked if people look at me like, Hey, this dude could do it. I can do it. Then I've done my job here way.
00:58:36:02 - 00:58:47:12
Wayne Mulder
I don't think that's exactly what I said, Jared, but we'll go with that. Well, this has been a lot of fun. Let me ask you well, two questions. First of all, what's next for you and your mission?
00:58:47:14 - 00:59:11:19
Jerrod Hardy
Next for me and my mission is to have a great 2023 just really getting out and add more agencies. I think we're like 50 some agencies around the country that teach our program. So I want to keep add to that, because I do are men and women that are serving on the streets need real training that they can believe in, that their family can believe in, and that gets them home every night right now.
00:59:11:19 - 00:59:37:24
Jerrod Hardy
No bullshit training. No, no kung fu stuff that hasn't worked since the seventies that we're still just checking boxes, but real, real good training. And then the podcast has taken on its own life. So I'm actually going to start some a workshop series in January called I'm Barry Your Life. Oh, great. Yeah, off of a pretty cool poem by Matthew Arnold called The Buried Life.
00:59:38:01 - 00:59:59:02
Jerrod Hardy
It was written in the 1850s that talks about, as your life goes, where did your life really go? And our life kind of gets buried under, all the things that come at us. And then we get to an end of life, like where the sadness was in the life I was supposed to live. Is that back over there?
00:59:59:04 - 01:00:19:22
Jerrod Hardy
So I want to start those that we're going to do small group workshops. January will be online and then I'm going to have some in-person stuff in the summer, maybe even out Wyoming, where we people come in and we really start peeling away some of the excuses, some of the layers, some of the reasons why we're not living the most purposeful life we could before.
01:00:19:22 - 01:00:23:23
Jerrod Hardy
It's too late and we end up with a ton of regrets.
01:00:24:00 - 01:00:39:10
Wayne Mulder
I think that's powerful. I will absolutely keep an eye on that and I'll be sure to link it up as well. Let me ask you my final question that I ask everybody who comes on the podcast. What is the one take away the one thing that law enforcement officers can do that's going to make a difference in their personal lives.
01:00:39:12 - 01:00:58:04
Jerrod Hardy
Have a plan to get out of it. You know, I mean, I think that's that's a true saying as we it hurts me inside. It breaks my heart when I go around Veteran officers that are looking at leaving and they talk about going to Walmart being a greeter. And I hear that all the time. That really hurts because I'm like, Dude, you have so much.
01:00:58:06 - 01:01:18:04
Jerrod Hardy
You have so much talent. Do you know what your skill set is right now? So that's why I would tell people, police officers to be better on the personal side is be better on the professional side. So like, find what it is you love about this career From me. I loved jujitsu, I loved coaching. And how do I do that outside?
01:01:18:04 - 01:01:33:15
Jerrod Hardy
Well, I own a gym. I'll create a gym and I'll build a gym so I can coach and do that. Right? But is the skills I got was in police work to help me over there. So Sue loves car crashes. Well, get really good at it and then go work for an insurance company or create your own right.
01:01:33:15 - 01:01:58:06
Jerrod Hardy
Like there's so many. Our skill set is so diverse and so in demand in the private sector. If we only take a minute to go, where is it? What is it I really like and what do I want to do next? Yeah, and then I would just add, Wayne, is if you have if you're supervising officers or you're around officers that are talking about what's coming next, that shouldn't be a shameful talk and law enforcement like it is.
01:01:58:08 - 01:01:59:11
Wayne Mulder
I agree.
01:01:59:13 - 01:02:20:19
Jerrod Hardy
Almost every fireman I know has a side hustle lawn business and that and that that that's kind of expected because their schedule works it. But you have a cop that says, hey, I'm thinking about maybe going to be a realtor. I'm thinking about going, it is. We almost shame them for having ideas outside police work. Yeah, but we all know at some point our career has to end.
01:02:20:19 - 01:02:22:15
Jerrod Hardy
It should end.
01:02:22:17 - 01:02:23:03
Wayne Mulder
Yep.
01:02:23:05 - 01:02:34:15
Jerrod Hardy
So what are we going to do next? And I think to wrap it all up, to be better at home, you got be no wonder why end. When do I end and why do I go to next would help you in that front.
01:02:34:17 - 01:02:46:06
Wayne Mulder
Yeah no that's great advice and I know we talked a little bit about that off line, but that's exactly I couldn't agree with you more, so I really appreciate that. What's the best way for people to connect with you?
01:02:46:08 - 01:02:58:07
Jerrod Hardy
LinkedIn's really good for me. Jared Hardy I'm on there. I'm pretty. I do a lot on LinkedIn. I have websites. Tim Hardy dot net for law enforcement stuff for the purpose podcast dot com for all the podcast stuff.
01:02:58:09 - 01:03:04:23
Wayne Mulder
Perfect. Jared I really appreciate it. This hour flew by, but I really appreciate your time. It's been a blast talking with you.
01:03:05:00 - 01:03:20:17
Jerrod Hardy
As my my pleasure. I can't get that one out and I want to just again, thank you for the good work you're doing in the community and the stories you're sharing. And you never know which episodes are going to find the right person the very right time. So thanks. Thank you for putting it out there.
01:03:20:19 - 01:03:26:06
Wayne Mulder
Thank you, Jared. I appreciate that. And I couldn't agree more. So that's why we do it every day. You have a great one.
01:03:26:08 - 01:03:27:15
Jerrod Hardy
You as well. Thank you.
01:03:27:17 - 01:04:01:03
Wayne Mulder
Thanks. So thank you all for watching or listening to this week's podcast. I hope you enjoyed it. Every episode has full show notes, links, all the good stuff, pictures, more information than what you get just in the blurb of the show notes on whatever platform you're watching this. So be sure to go to on the blue line dot com o n on the blue line dot com, click through to the show notes tab or you can just go on the blue line dot com forward slash show notes and on there you're going to get everything about every episode that we've released and I really appreciate you watching and thank you.
01:04:01:06 - 01:04:21:12
Wayne Mulder
None of this would be possible without you, the listener. So that is all for today. Don't forget that. I'll see you hopefully next Monday in the morning. Roll call. Yes, those are coming back. So hopefully next Monday in Morning Roll Call and then the next Thursday in the interview room with another episode with another great guest. So in the meantime, I'm going to see you out there on the blue line.