PODCAST: It is time that we put LAW ENFORCEMENT back into POLICING with Sgt. Betsy Smith | TIR 065
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It is time that we put LAW ENFORCEMENT back into POLICING with Sgt. Betsy Smith | TIR 065
Meet this Weeks Guest: Sgt. Betsy Smith
Sgt. Betsy Brantner Smith retired in 2009 as a 29-year veteran of a large metropolitan police department in the Chicago suburbs. Beginning her career as a police dispatcher at age 17, Betsy became an officer four years later and has held positions in patrol, investigations, narcotics, juvenile, hostage negotiation, crime prevention and field training. She received her four-year degree from Western Illinois University in 1991, and was a class officer and graduate of the Northwestern University Center for Public Safety’s School of Staff and Command in May of 2001.
She supervised her department’s K-9 Unit, served as a field training sergeant, recruitment team sergeant, bike patrol coordinator, Crowd Control Bike Team leader, and supervisor of the Community Education/Crime Prevention Unit. Betsy served on the Elderly Services Team, the Crisis Intervention Team, and was a proud founding supervisory member of NPD’s Honor Guard Unit. Betsy received numerous awards and commendations from her police department as well as many local and national awards for her performance as a police officer and supervisor.
From 1999 – 2003 Betsy hosted various training programs and was a content expert for the Law Enforcement Television Network (LETN), is currently an on-air commentator and advisor for the Police One Academy and was a featured character in the Biography Channel’s “Female Forces” reality show.
She has been a law enforcement trainer for over 20 years and was a content expert and senior instructor for the Calibre Press “Street Survival” seminar from 2003 through 2012 where she also created the “Street Survival for Women” seminar. Betsy is a popular keynote speaker at conferences and events throughout the United States and has trained in various international venues. Since 1995, Betsy has authored hundreds of articles for law enforcement, government and civilian publications including Innovations in Government, Police Marksman, Law and Order, Police Chief, Law Officer, PoliceLink.com, PoliceOne.com, LawOfficer.com and various civilian firearms magazines through Harris Publications including “Combat Handguns.” She served on the advisory board of Police Marksman magazine, was a featured columnist and video contributor on Officer.Com, NationalPolice.org and PoliceOne.Com. Betsy is a media analyst and the spokesman for the National Police Association and is a sought-after law enforcement analyst on radio, in television and in print.
Betsy is the creator of the only course of its kind for women in law enforcement, “The Winning Mind for Women” and is the owner of The Winning Mind LLC. Together, Betsy and her husband Dave develop and instruct cutting edge courses and travel extensively, bringing their inspirational messages throughout the world.
Betsy can be reached through her website at FemaleForces.com.
Show Notes from This Episode
We know first-hand the struggle of trying not to take the job home with us and let it affect our families. We know the toll the law enforcement career can have on marriages and relationships. And we also have been frustrated by the lack of authentic leadership in our agencies. This Law Enforcement Podcast was designed to help you overcome the mental toll of the law enforcement career and the negative effects it can have on your personal life.
Hosted by active-duty law enforcement, we bring you two weekly podcasts. On Thursday, in The Interview Room we sit down with amazing guests who provide actionable advice on leadership, mental health, and relationships from their lived experiences. On Monday, in Morning Roll Call, you and I enjoy a cup of coffee and discuss current events, offer encouragement, and discuss practical steps for achieving the life we were meant to live.
Go Deeper:
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TOPICS discussed:
· Police Reform. Police Change.
· Female undercover police officers.
· Female law enforcement in the 1980s.
· De-escalation and female police.
· National Police Association.
· Black Lives Matter.
· Defund the Police Movement.
· Second Amendment Support.
· Law Enforcement Response times.
· Putting LAW ENFORCEMENT back into POLCIING.
· Law Enforcement and Politics.
· Co-Responder Mental Health programs for Law Enforcement.
· Being a criminal is a conscious choice.
· Amicus Briefs
· Border Patrol “whipping case.”
· The soft bigotry of low expectations.
· Believing in something bigger than you.
CONNECT with Betsy:
· WEBSITE: http://femaleforces.com/
· WEBSITE: http://jdbucksavage.com
· TWITTER/X: https://twitter.com/sgtbetsysmith
· TWITTER/X: https://twitter.com/NatPoliceAssoc
· WEBSITE: https://nationalpolice.org/main/
· YOUTUBE: National Police Association: NPA Report
RESOURCES mentioned:
· BOOK: Work with Me: The 8 Blind Spots between men and women in business. By Barbara Annis and John Gray.
AFTER the episode:
• LEAVE US AN iTUNES rating and review! [This is a HUGE help]
• VISIT OUR Website: https://www.ontheblueline.com/
• EMAIL me your feedback: Feedback@OnTheBlueLine.com
• Get the eBook, “How the law enforcement makes you cynical and what you can do about it” by Wayne Mulder.
On The Blue Line was founded and is operated by active-duty law enforcement to fulfill the mission of helping law enforcement overcome the mental health toll of the profession to become better leaders & protectors on & off the job.
We strive to create a world where law enforcement life expectancies are equal with the general population.
HONOR | EMPOWER | EDUCATE | DEFEND
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TRANSCRIPTION OF EPISODE. Please note this is a new service we are offering and there will be spelling, grammar and accuracy issues. This transcription is offered as a convenience to our listeners, but at this time it is not guaranteed to be accurate.
00:00:08:09 - 00:00:26:05
Wayne Mulder
Welcome my friends at the On the Blue Line podcast for law enforcement. I am your host, Wayne Mulder. This is the podcast that helps law enforcement officers overcome the mental health toll, the profession to be better leaders and protectors on and off the job. This week in the interview room, I sit down with retired Sergeant Betsy Smith.
00:00:26:07 - 00:00:48:09
Wayne Mulder
You may not need any introduction, but she is the spokeswoman for the National Police Association. We discuss what it's like being a female in law enforcement antelope hunting in Wyoming, what it's like discussing policing matters with media on all sides of the political aisle, and what she is doing to ensure that the cops voice our voice, our point of view is what is being brought to the national media.
00:00:48:14 - 00:00:53:22
Wayne Mulder
Another great episode of the On the Blue Line podcast. Well, it starts now.
00:00:53:24 - 00:00:58:05
Because, you know, it's only going to get a.
00:00:58:05 - 00:00:59:03
Sgt Betsy Smith
Season slow.
00:00:59:04 - 00:01:09:20
Wayne Mulder
When you break the law. If you decide to do this, we're going to hold you responsible. You are the only good thing in someone's worst day. That is a privilege for a police officer.
00:01:09:21 - 00:01:15:06
Sgt Betsy Smith
At the very least, you could honor the sacrifices of police officers and their families.
00:01:15:12 - 00:01:43:03
Wayne Mulder
We have the ability to save the Republic on paper. Welcome. Thank you so much for coming back and listening. And yes, things are going to get better. I love the new anthem and it really is the heart of everything I'm trying to do here. So no matter how negative or depressing, what I talk about from week to week is I ensure you things are going to get better.
00:01:43:03 - 00:02:04:23
Wayne Mulder
And I. How do I know that? Wink, wink? How do you know they're going to get better? Well, because I have faith in you. I know you and I are going to stand up and we're going to do this. So that is why I can be so optimistic about it. Most active on Twitter or X, whatever you want to call it, at on the blue line and the number one, be sure to join me there.
00:02:05:01 - 00:02:22:05
Wayne Mulder
And if you would, we're also on all the other social media Down the Blue Line podcast. However, I am most active on Twitter. You will see some of my snarky comments. I try to be a little bit entertaining and yet I also try to be informative. So I'm the blue line in the number one and most active on there.
00:02:22:05 - 00:02:40:17
Wayne Mulder
And then the other big favor, if you would, if you are listening this content. If you enjoy this content, we want you to be honest. But a five star review is huge. So if you'd hit five stars, especially on iTunes, it makes a big difference. Or Apple podcast, I guess is what's called now. But it would make a big difference in helping us out.
00:02:40:17 - 00:02:59:07
Wayne Mulder
So thank you very much. So let's get straight to it. Let's talk about this week's guest, that Sergeant Betsy Brantner Smith, retired 29 year veteran of a large metropolitan Police department in the Chicago suburbs where she began as a dispatcher at the age of 17 and then moved on into law enforcement career. She talks all about it in this podcast.
00:02:59:07 - 00:03:19:05
Wayne Mulder
And I think you're going to enjoy all the different positions and things that she's learned. And she does speak specifically to females in law enforcement. I think you're going to enjoy that part as well, because that isn't really a topic that I've discussed a lot on here, because needless to say, I'm not an expert at it. She's been a law enforcement trainer for over 20 years, content expert and senior instructor for Caliber Press.
00:03:19:05 - 00:03:44:20
Wayne Mulder
The Street Survival Seminar. She also created Street Survival for Women Seminar. She's a popular keynote speaker at all sorts of events from across the country, and she's been in all sorts of government and civilian publications to include police, one offs, hardcore civilian firearms, magazines. On and on it goes, she is a media analyst and she's currently the spokesperson for the National Police Association.
00:03:44:20 - 00:04:10:21
Wayne Mulder
She's a sought after law enforcement analyst on radio, television, print. She's been on all of them. If you just do a search, you'll find her all over the place. But she does a great job and she is a creator of the only course of its kind for women in law enforcement called the winning mind for women and is the owner of Winning Mind LLC and her and her husband Dave, who you'll get to meet in another week, develop and instruct cutting edge courses in travel extensively to get their message out.
00:04:10:23 - 00:04:35:18
Wayne Mulder
What she's doing at the National Police Association isn't for police per se, even though it benefits all of us. It's for the public. And Betsy does just a phenomenal job. She's got a great personality, an infectious smile, and she does a really great job of getting the message of what matters to law enforcement out to the public. When she analyzes different of that.
00:04:35:23 - 00:04:42:07
Wayne Mulder
So enough for me. It's time to hear from this week's guest, Betsy Smith. Well, Betsy, welcome to the show.
00:04:42:09 - 00:04:45:10
Sgt Betsy Smith
Hey, thanks for having me. I'm excited to be able to do this.
00:04:45:15 - 00:04:58:18
Wayne Mulder
Yes, well, you are by far the media expert, but we'll get into that here in a minute. I'm so happy we get the opportunity to sit here and have a conversation. Let me start with you as I do with everybody. It's my get to know your questions. Coffee or tea?
00:04:58:20 - 00:05:06:21
Sgt Betsy Smith
Oh, coffee. Main line. I would inject it if I could. Cannot function without it.
00:05:06:23 - 00:05:10:24
Wayne Mulder
I am with you there. 100%. So I'm assuming is a black coffee then.
00:05:11:01 - 00:05:16:07
Sgt Betsy Smith
Now I'm kind of a weenie. I got to have. I got to have my heavy cream in it.
00:05:16:09 - 00:05:19:21
Wayne Mulder
Okay, well, that's okay. So not lots of sugar. Just the heavy.
00:05:19:21 - 00:05:21:19
Sgt Betsy Smith
Cream. No sugar.
00:05:21:21 - 00:05:25:23
Wayne Mulder
Where's your favorite place to have that drink? Coffee.
00:05:26:00 - 00:05:34:24
Sgt Betsy Smith
Wow. I would say outside of my RV with my three dogs and my husband on a camping trip.
00:05:35:01 - 00:05:43:24
Wayne Mulder
I'm sure that would be the perfect spot. And do you have a speaking of camping, do you have a best or worst travel story?
00:05:44:01 - 00:06:14:17
Sgt Betsy Smith
Oh, Lord, I have. I have. I have traveled so much. I mean, let me say this. I was traveling so much when I was a working street sergeant. I was also traveling full time doing law enforcement training around the country. And I got to the point where I woke up one morning in a hotel and I had to look at the phone on the nightstand next to me to determine what city I was in.
00:06:14:19 - 00:06:24:11
Wayne Mulder
That's a lot of traveling. What was that training role? What were you just I know I'm kind of jumping off target here already, but what was that training role then?
00:06:24:13 - 00:06:52:03
Sgt Betsy Smith
Sure. So I have been I national level trainer for several decades. But at one point in my career into the 2000, I was the only and still and the only female to ever teach the Street Survival Seminar at that time by caliber press. And and so we traveled throughout the country. We also went to Macedonia and Bulgaria to teach it.
00:06:52:03 - 00:06:59:21
Sgt Betsy Smith
And so, yeah, I was doing that full time and I was a full time patrol sergeant as well. And in a way.
00:06:59:23 - 00:07:02:05
Wayne Mulder
What a great opportunity, though.
00:07:02:07 - 00:07:03:13
Sgt Betsy Smith
It was amazing.
00:07:03:15 - 00:07:12:02
Wayne Mulder
So let me ask you, my one of my last of these get to know your questions. What is your favorite modern nonfiction book?
00:07:12:04 - 00:07:50:02
Sgt Betsy Smith
My favorite modern nonfiction book. Wow. Okay. So this is probably what every Christian says, but it's the Bible. I and the older I get, the more profound it becomes. And recently, in the last couple of years, I've started studying the the the historical nature of the Bible. And and I've learned that it's all provable, which, you know, a lot of people believe that the Bible is just a bunch of stories and parables to make people behave.
00:07:50:04 - 00:07:57:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
And in reality it's all true, which makes it and I a fascinating nonfiction book.
00:07:57:18 - 00:08:20:07
Wayne Mulder
I would agree with you 100%. It is. I was very fortunate to grow up in the church, and I went to a school where one of the big things they did was teach the historical relevance of it as well. So it wasn't all just it wasn't, hey, just read the Bible. It was here's the stories that were going on that we know from just common literature that we know were happening at the same time that this story is.
00:08:20:07 - 00:08:28:21
Wayne Mulder
And then, like you said, you can start piecing it together and really, you know, in many ways become a forensic take a forensic account of what actually occurred.
00:08:28:23 - 00:08:36:09
Sgt Betsy Smith
Yeah, there's archeology, there's history, there's science, there's astronomy. It's amazing.
00:08:36:11 - 00:08:48:14
Wayne Mulder
Yeah. No, it's powerful. I love that answer. So my last of these, what is that place that brings you the most piece where that favorite spot to just stop breathing, enjoy life?
00:08:48:16 - 00:09:14:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
Wow. I would have to say there's a little town in Wyoming called Wheatland, Wyoming, and we own a little piece of property there. But I have some amazing friends there, and it's where I first learned how to hunt. And and we go there every year and do some antelope hunting and some bird hunting. And it just Wyoming is such a huge place.
00:09:14:18 - 00:09:39:07
Sgt Betsy Smith
And, you know. Yeah. And you look at the mountains and you look at the cattle and the and the deer and the antelope. Sounds like a song and, and you know, just on the four wheeler with my dogs looking at Laramie Peak, I feel tiny, but so connected and so peaceful.
00:09:39:09 - 00:09:58:03
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, I can imagine. I love the mountains antelope hunting that has got to be with those things are so skittish. I mean, we've pretty much got to be talking like a rifle, right from quite a distance. Is that essentially antelope hunting? Because I have yet to hunt in the West. I'm I'm a midwest boy, so I'm from Michigan originally.
00:09:58:05 - 00:10:06:03
Wayne Mulder
So that's my world. But I love the West and I've been out there many times. But yeah, I can't even imagine hunting those little critters the way they look.
00:10:06:05 - 00:10:31:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
It's amazing. They're they're they're so beautiful to watch. And again, I'm an Illinois girl, so, of course, you know, we we had, you know, shotgun, deer hunting. But my husband first took me to Wyoming in the analog. Never saw anything like an analog before in my life except in the movies. And they're amazing to watch. And you don't you can't stock them and you really can't just sit and wait for them like you do a deer.
00:10:31:18 - 00:10:57:19
Sgt Betsy Smith
You just have to have incredible timing and incredible luck and yeah, you use a rifle. I my round is I use a seven mauser and some good optics. And we like to I like to say, because I love animals so much, I want them to just be munching on grass one second and be an antelope heaven next and not know what hit them.
00:10:57:19 - 00:11:04:08
Sgt Betsy Smith
I don't ever want them to suffer. So they are so delicious. So. Yeah. Oh, incredible. Yeah.
00:11:04:08 - 00:11:22:14
Wayne Mulder
All right. I will have to try this some time. It's on my list from there. Let's kind of go into you. We've hit on a couple highlights of your story, but let's go a little bit through your origin story, because you were also a farm girl. Correct. And then ended up working at a metropolitan agency. Like how does that all come together?
00:11:22:16 - 00:11:46:02
Sgt Betsy Smith
So I am I am an Illinois farm girl and raised about two and a half hours outside of Chicago, you know, very rural area. Yeah. And when I was I had told my parents I wanted to be a cop from the time I was in about junior high. So I was. I am 63 years old. I'm so I graduated high school in 1977.
00:11:46:02 - 00:12:13:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
So in 76, my dad was on the Merrick Commission of our county Sheriff's department. And the sheriff there said, well, if she wants to be a cop because women were cops back then. Right. And let's see if she how she does as a dispatcher. We'll see if she really likes it. So they tried everything to scare me, grossed me out, you know, showed me all the crime scene photos, all that in my in my real sheriff's department.
00:12:13:16 - 00:12:40:09
Sgt Betsy Smith
And so this whole second half of my senior year, I worked the 4 to 12 shift, 4 p.m. to midnight as a dispatcher. Then I went to college. I did that for a couple of years in college, and then two weeks out of college, I became a police officer in the Chicago suburbs. So it was it was a it was a quick five years and I discovered that I absolutely loved police work.
00:12:40:11 - 00:13:00:10
Wayne Mulder
Wow. That had to be something. Because even though I know Chicago is in the news a lot these days, but even back then, Chicago has always been a city that has kept itself in the news. So from organized crime to I mean, because I'm from Michigan, but I grew up in Indiana, so from Fort Wayne. So the other side of the cornfields and soybeans.
00:13:00:12 - 00:13:13:14
Wayne Mulder
So I'm somewhat familiar with that area. It had a lot of friend, the friends that actually went to school in Hammond, Indiana. So not too far out of that area. And it has always been an issue. So I'm just kind of curious. I had to be shocking going from the farm.
00:13:13:14 - 00:13:32:17
Sgt Betsy Smith
Because I have to tell you that when I when I moved there, I went to college in the kind of in the country in the middle of the state. So I get to the Chicago suburbs and it was the fastest growing suburb in Chicago. And I went to the police academy in Cook County, Illinois, just outside of the Chicago city limits.
00:13:32:17 - 00:13:58:11
Sgt Betsy Smith
And I mean, it was absolute culture shock. I had never seen I hadn't done much interstate driving. I, I just really was unfamiliar with city life. So I'm in the police academy and and yeah, it was shocking. Chicago had a lot of crime. And I after the academy into the eighties, I got put on a statewide task force and I did a lot of work in the city of Chicago.
00:13:58:11 - 00:14:30:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
And in the eighties, of course, crack cocaine, lots of powder cocaine. I spent four years undercover. And again, there just weren't many women doing what we were doing. And so being the only female undercover, I was getting loaned out, you know, all these different agencies, federal agencies. I actually worked in three different states. And and and I learned a whole lot about about the city of Chicago, about firearms, about crime.
00:14:30:18 - 00:14:35:08
Sgt Betsy Smith
It was an amazing experience for a farm kid from northern Illinois, I'm certain.
00:14:35:08 - 00:14:53:15
Wayne Mulder
That's awesome. So I always typically ask, is everyone just saying you work in law enforcement as you know, everybody can have completely different experiences and you've touched on some of them. But later in your career, did you kind of specialize was it more in the training side? Was it more because I know you also did some stuff in like crisis intervention and so forth.
00:14:53:17 - 00:14:57:01
Wayne Mulder
What kind of road did you take through your law enforcement journey?
00:14:57:03 - 00:15:23:11
Sgt Betsy Smith
You know, training really wasn't my first love. I was a real action junkie. And so I, you know, after spending a just a couple of years on patrol, then I went I went into investigations and I did everything paper crimes, property crimes, you know, all that working on homicides. And then I did the undercover thing. And that's where I really honed my my tactics.
00:15:23:11 - 00:15:52:14
Sgt Betsy Smith
I really and learned how to not how to qualify, but how to win a gunfight. And and I actually in 1985, when I started in Narcotics, I went to my first street survival seminar taught by a guy named Dave Smith, JD Buck Savage. For a lot of our officers and and so I really learned that there were some things that I really needed to understand about tactics and my tools and my firearms.
00:15:52:16 - 00:16:34:11
Sgt Betsy Smith
When I left narcotics after four years, I, I thought the best way to prepare myself for supervision was to become a field training officer. So I went to field training school and it's there. I really started to get interested in in the brain and the physiology of training. And and I just I trained a ton of recruits, went back into detectives, got promoted, and again as a supervisor, got very interested in training, started doing training on my own and writing not so much in my agency, but outside of my agency.
00:16:34:13 - 00:16:52:12
Sgt Betsy Smith
And and it just kind of took off from there. And I've always found that writing and training go hand in hand, because as a writer, you've got to really learn and continue to keep up. And that lends itself to being a really good current trainer.
00:16:52:14 - 00:17:06:19
Wayne Mulder
And I would even argue or agree with that, and then add to it that you also have to be able break things down in the writing process, which is very important in the training process, is that ability to break it down into small, actionable steps.
00:17:06:20 - 00:17:34:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
That's absolutely true. And that's one of my that's always been one of my pieces of advice to new trainers that that if you you've got a training class and you want to get the word out there, turn it into an Arctic a literally sit down with your presentation and and block it out and, and vice versa. If you've written an article and you want to do training on that topic, you just take that article and turn it into a presentation block by block.
00:17:34:21 - 00:17:36:22
Sgt Betsy Smith
So they really do go hand in hand.
00:17:36:24 - 00:18:02:18
Wayne Mulder
Yeah, No, that's good. So from here, let me actually I wanna go down a different road real quick because I looked at a lot. You've written so many articles, I can't read them all prepping for the show. You've written a few. I'll just say something I can't really speak to. So when I started this podcast, I started it really with empowering law enforcement officers in their personal lives and something obviously I can't really speak to is women in law enforcement.
00:18:02:24 - 00:18:30:24
Wayne Mulder
And that is something that you write about quite a bit. I looked at some of your articles like, What advice would you give to a female rookie? Three safety concerns for female cops, etc., and so on. My question would be, obviously the world has changed since the eighties nineties and I believe as 2009 when you retired. But that being said, for all the changes, it's still different and still struggle because I hear the feedback from a lot of the female listeners, listeners that I have plus females that I work with.
00:18:30:24 - 00:18:37:18
Wayne Mulder
So can you speak to that a little bit, being a female in law enforcement and then maybe just some considerations and so forth as well?
00:18:37:20 - 00:19:02:01
Sgt Betsy Smith
Oh, absolutely. I mean, you know, I entered the police academy in January of 1981, and there were four women. It started on Monday. And by Friday, I was the only woman left. I mean, we just were excuse me, we were hazed and we were we were abused. I mean, it's just how it was. And, you know, you could do one of two things.
00:19:02:03 - 00:19:36:22
Sgt Betsy Smith
You could quit and go do something else or you could try and tough it out. There really wasn't back then. Nobody was suing anybody. And so I learned how to do my job and and deal with, you know, yes, there was harassment. Yes, there was discrimination, all of that. So, yeah, but I mean, in the eighties, you know, our motto as women was to work twice as hard and get half as much credit.
00:19:36:22 - 00:19:56:01
Sgt Betsy Smith
And that's what we did. I started studying in the late eighties when I became a field training officer, and I saw the differences between my female recruits and my male workers. I thought, Well, this is something I better pay attention to. So I started to study the brain. I say physiology. I saw how we shoot different, how we fight different.
00:19:56:07 - 00:20:21:03
Sgt Betsy Smith
Most women cops. And you can ask this of your female colleagues and you've probably seen it is that most women cops will tell you that they have gotten countless numbers of people, men, into a set of handcuffs and into the back of their patrol car without hardly having to touch them. Yep, because we do things differently. We you know, there's a lot of talk in modern policing our de-escalation.
00:20:21:05 - 00:20:42:15
Sgt Betsy Smith
Women are natural de-escalate, especially when we're dealing with a man. It's different when it's woman to woman, just like it's different when it's man to man. And so we don't teach that stuff. We talk about everybody is equal. Everybody's the same. And and frankly, we do ourselves a disservice. So. So to answer your question, is it still different for women?
00:20:42:17 - 00:21:11:13
Sgt Betsy Smith
Partially, yes. It's there's always going to be probably more men than women in in the street part of law enforcement and and is this because is this because law enforcement's a lousy career for women? Absolutely not. But there's really only a certain part of the female population that is attracted to this job. And believe me, I have studied this.
00:21:11:19 - 00:21:29:22
Sgt Betsy Smith
I have talked to the media about this for the last 25 years. And I have had media asked, well, if we just said I've had academics ask me to if we just made law enforcement more family friendly, wouldn't more women be attracted to it basically, then if you do that, what you're saying is to men, your parenting doesn't matter.
00:21:29:24 - 00:21:51:22
Sgt Betsy Smith
We've got to we just have to with the women as peers, you can't do that. So, you know, there's just a certain just like there's just certain men that are attracted to the law enforcement profession. There's just certain women that are attracted to it. And quite frankly, there's always going to be less women. But the women in this profession are amazing.
00:21:51:24 - 00:22:05:13
Sgt Betsy Smith
And and we have to continue to uplift them, just like we have to continue uplift the men in this profession. We got to stop separating us out. But we need to learn the differences and train to them.
00:22:05:15 - 00:22:31:09
Wayne Mulder
Yes, that's that's wonderful. And as a frontline supervisor, I've been fortunate to have squads that have, in fact, currently a squad that has several. In fact, there's more women than men on my current squad. And it's it's great because like you said, especially when you get into things like de-escalation, behavioral health and so forth, it's it's wonderful, but it also gives you a completely different mindset.
00:22:31:09 - 00:22:48:16
Wayne Mulder
Now, what's funny to me, and I don't know, maybe this is just a male female thing, but a lot of them I'll get complaints about working with other females, like they would rather be on a squad with guys. So I don't know what that is exactly. Being a male, maybe I just don't understand. But yeah, that is a common complaint I get from the females.
00:22:48:18 - 00:23:11:07
Sgt Betsy Smith
There's something called the Queen Bee syndrome and you know, because that's that's something that there's always been there's this myth and I again, I've seen this for decades where the police administer minister says even all men try and put the women all together and hopefully and hope that they will uplift each other. Well, it depends on the personality of the women.
00:23:11:07 - 00:23:26:24
Sgt Betsy Smith
You know, all women are you all women don't think alike, just like all men don't think alike. And I'm sure you've seen this in your agency where somebody will come to and you might even done it as a supervisor. You know, you go to one of the women on your squad and you say, So what are the women think about this?
00:23:27:01 - 00:23:48:08
Sgt Betsy Smith
And you know, and you do it perfectly. You know, it is silly, but all the women don't think alike. But we make that mistake. And so, yeah, we need to treat everybody as individually. But I and I. But I want to stress to the women out there in law enforcement, do your damnedest to uplift each other, you know, to try to be that queen bee.
00:23:48:10 - 00:24:16:08
Sgt Betsy Smith
And, and if you're, if you're frustrated with a member of your agency that's also female, you don't think, you know, she's not tough enough. She's not. She's not that. Then then suck it up and mentor her and do what you can. I wrote an article a long time ago for our sitcom about mentoring someone that you hate. You know, it's easy to mentor someone you really like.
00:24:16:10 - 00:24:33:04
Sgt Betsy Smith
Find that woman. I'm going to specially say this to the women listening. Find that woman on your agency or at a neighboring agency. If you're in a small department that you just can't stand because of this and this and this and this. Become her mentor and guide her toward where you think she ought to be.
00:24:33:06 - 00:24:57:06
Wayne Mulder
That's great advice for men and women alike. So I'm going to find that article and I'll be sure to link it up as well. One more question down this road then. I'm going to completely switch gears on you, but I want to ask one more question because you kind of brought it up. You mentioned the training. When we talk about females in training, understanding the difference, what would be one of one thing you would highlight, like if you could pick one, what would be like a priority that it's like, Well, we're not there yet.
00:24:57:11 - 00:24:59:14
Wayne Mulder
We need to do this.
00:24:59:16 - 00:25:30:14
Sgt Betsy Smith
I think the biggest thing is the communication differences. And in fact, we have a class that we teach. In fact, I took it into the Pentagon until COVID and we put it in all our classes, leadership, officer safety, all that. And it's called the truth about gender differences. And when it comes to communication and we talk about the differences between how men and women communicate, if we could just understand that I was I literally was in a meeting a couple of hours ago.
00:25:30:16 - 00:25:52:09
Sgt Betsy Smith
I was two men, one who was my husband and and two women. And the woman who was very high powered woman in this meeting is two is talking and talking and talking. My husband mutes his phone and looks at you guys and she's talking to my child. I go, Honey, she's a woman because women have about 20,000 words a day.
00:25:52:09 - 00:26:09:10
Sgt Betsy Smith
We need to get out when men have 5 to 7000. So when we are in a meeting, we talk a lot. If we could just understand one thing about each other, we would communicate a whole lot more effectively in the workplace and at home.
00:26:09:12 - 00:26:18:05
Wayne Mulder
Well, yeah, and that is astonishing too, when you think about that fact. And then of course, it leads to a lot of misunderstandings and complaining about each other.
00:26:18:07 - 00:26:43:22
Sgt Betsy Smith
Huge misunderstanding. There's a great book out there called Work With Me by John Gray and I have to think of the field, the female author, The Road to Barbara. And it's maybe and but it's called Work With Me. And it is the differences between men and women at work. And I will change your life. Okay. Everybody should go get that buggy You probably get a used on Amazon's a few years old.
00:26:44:01 - 00:26:46:05
Sgt Betsy Smith
You probably paid five bucks for its fantastic book.
00:26:46:11 - 00:26:49:02
Wayne Mulder
Well, then it's a must read, so I will be sure.
00:26:49:06 - 00:26:50:10
Sgt Betsy Smith
That must read.
00:26:50:12 - 00:27:09:19
Wayne Mulder
I will be sure to find it and link that one up as well. So let's switch gears almost completely here and talk well, or you can segway in between because honestly, at some point you end up coming to the National Police Association. But I'm assuming there were some things that happened in between there. So if you want to walk us through that, you can or we can go to what you're doing now with the National Police Association.
00:27:09:21 - 00:27:32:13
Sgt Betsy Smith
Well, sure. I so I had a great 29 career, 29 year career police here in the Chicago suburbs. And and I had a ball. I mean, I was I did all kinds of different things, you know, training. And I ran K-9, I ran the crowd control bike team. And I ran the, you know, crisis intervention team. And and I ran a patrol team.
00:27:32:13 - 00:27:52:10
Sgt Betsy Smith
I ran animal Control. I ran the crime prevention, you know, I mean, I did all kinds of just tons of cool things. And so when I retired in 2009, at this point, I'm already a full time trainer with the Street Survival Seminar. Plus we're doing training on our own. I do all sorts of survival training for women. I do it for everybody.
00:27:52:10 - 00:28:15:19
Sgt Betsy Smith
I do it for dispatchers. We've developed some specific curriculum for dispatchers. And and I was writing for all these different magazines and this and that. Well, my husband got me to move to Arizona out of Illinois, out of the Midwest, to a place where it doesn't snow Southern Arizona. I couldn't be happier. And and so we're just going along with our training career and writing career.
00:28:15:21 - 00:28:50:08
Sgt Betsy Smith
And when the George Floyd situation happened, I was already doing a little bit of writing for the National Police Association, which is it's not an organization for cops to join. What it is is it's a non for profit that brings attention to whatever anti-police efforts have to be going on at the time, whether it's by activist groups, whether it's by even certain you know, parts of the law enforcement community, by by the media, things like that.
00:28:50:08 - 00:29:21:15
Sgt Betsy Smith
And so we get involved in we publish books, we write articles, we have a website, the national sort. We file amicus briefs in different court cases. And but they didn't have a national spokesman. So right after George Floyd, there was a situation happening in California where there was a police department that these officers had to come to work and look at a Black Lives Matter mural where one of the letters was a depiction of Assata Shakur.
00:29:21:15 - 00:29:47:08
Sgt Betsy Smith
If you know anything about her, she's a cop murderer. She's a convicted cop killer. These cops had to come to work every day and see her this 32 foot high. Assata Shakur, her picture in a Black Lives Matter mural. And so the head of the organization got a hold. Me. So when you talk to the media about this, you've been on camera before because I was with the law enforcement television network and then with the police academy doing a lot of camera work.
00:29:47:10 - 00:30:18:10
Sgt Betsy Smith
So I said, sure, I can do that. And so I was interviewed and then another station reached out, another station and he hired me. He said, I would like to be our national spokesman. I'm like, Sure, I'll talk to anybody. Yeah. So two years later, two and a half years later, that's what I do for the National Association is I bring I bring the cops point of view into the national media.
00:30:18:12 - 00:30:30:23
Wayne Mulder
I love that. And that makes more sense. Now, I was going to ask that with the National Police Association, because some of the writings and stuff on there seemed aimed more at the general public than law enforcement so that all actually makes a lot of sense to.
00:30:31:03 - 00:30:51:15
Sgt Betsy Smith
Me at this point. That's what we do. We do public service announcements. We we have a podcast called the OR it's a video podcast on Pluto, and I'm the first TV watcher, Bill O'Reilly streaming network, and then it's on our YouTube page called the the NPR Report, where we just interview just all kinds of different police leaders and citizens.
00:30:51:15 - 00:31:17:01
Sgt Betsy Smith
And we cover all kinds of different issues, and we're just trying to get the public to understand that cop point of view. We're apolitical. We don't get involved in politics. I'll interview candidates, but we never we don't say vote for this guy or vote for this woman. We just let people know how they can support law enforcement. We give out grants.
00:31:17:01 - 00:32:00:03
Sgt Betsy Smith
You know, we'll help an explorer program get going or buy a canine. A vast of the department can't, you know, can't afford it. And and my role is it is just to speak for my brothers and sisters out there and you know and talk about, you know, whether it's tactically or emotionally, procedurally. And it can be tough. I've been I've been on and I do this internationally, you know, I've been on where I've had Antifa activists call me a liar and and, you know, lots of arguments I've been on Dr. Phil, where it's getting real heated with an activist and, you know, all kinds of stuff.
00:32:00:03 - 00:32:01:21
Sgt Betsy Smith
So but it's a pretty fun job.
00:32:01:23 - 00:32:27:03
Wayne Mulder
Wow. Yeah, I haven't seen some of those yet, but a couple of things. You do a fabulous job and you have an infectious, beautiful smile. So that that helps. But yeah, you do. You do a fabulous job. And I watched a couple of the ones you run with Fox, Fox Business and so forth. But then I saw one where you were on Cheddar news and you did a really good job, probably better than I would have done in that situation.
00:32:27:03 - 00:32:29:24
Wayne Mulder
So you did a great job answering the questions.
00:32:30:01 - 00:32:55:20
Sgt Betsy Smith
Thank you. Yeah. You know that cheddar news that I did? I had no idea what the topic was going to be. So. So sometimes you get they'll ask you to do one topic and then it goes live and it's a totally different topic. Sometimes. I've been on I've literally been in the virtual green room for Newsmax, listening to the president speak, and then they come right to me and ask me to react.
00:32:55:20 - 00:33:00:05
Sgt Betsy Smith
And so it's a it's pretty exciting.
00:33:00:07 - 00:33:09:16
Wayne Mulder
I'm sure. Yeah, I can imagine. Yeah, some of them I'd be a little nervous, like some of these news organizations. I'd be a little nervous on what they were going to walk me into once.
00:33:09:18 - 00:33:33:15
Sgt Betsy Smith
Once they came up on stage, a lot of things. And, and, you know, I, I just again, I just always try and do my best for for my brothers and sisters for Third Street. Law enforcement is is the people I love, the people I care about and the people that we're trying to to help help the most, you know, and of course, the entire the entire profession.
00:33:33:15 - 00:33:40:01
Sgt Betsy Smith
But but, you know, the cops that are doing the job are the people that are near and dear to our hearts.
00:33:40:03 - 00:33:58:22
Wayne Mulder
Well, and it's it's obvious and it's appreciated. Let me ask your opinion on a couple things because there's a couple of topics you talk a lot about. And I'd be curious to hear your thoughts when we talk because it is such a large thing that's discussed in the media of came out of the whole defund the police movement and so forth.
00:33:58:22 - 00:34:15:16
Wayne Mulder
But when we talk about police reform, what are your thoughts on that terminology from the perspective of law enforcement? Because I am one who believes that there are some changes and some things that need to be updated and move forward. But I'd be curious on your thoughts on this.
00:34:15:18 - 00:34:43:05
Sgt Betsy Smith
Well, sure, I the problem with that term police reform is it has grown to mean keep cops from doing their jobs and or all cops are bad. And so we just have to stop what they're doing. It's just like criminal justice reform, you know, to some people that means stopping people from going to jail or stopping people from going to trial.
00:34:43:07 - 00:35:24:23
Sgt Betsy Smith
So can the law enforcement profession be better? Of course. And again, remember, I did in the law enforcement profession since 1976. So I have seen reform, I have seen changes. And whether it's from an officer shot survival standpoint or a leadership standpoint or how we deal with the public. So, yeah, can we always be improving? Absolutely. The problem with that police reform is that in the last really since about 2014 and especially since 2020, it has grown to mean stop cops from doing their job.
00:35:24:23 - 00:35:56:11
Sgt Betsy Smith
And what we really need to do is put law enforcement back into policing, you know, and the thing is, is we have American law enforcement have been tasked with taking care of every social ill there is out there. And frankly, it's gotten worse in the last two and a half years where everybody wants us to be everything from, you know, as a psychologist and and a babysitter.
00:35:56:17 - 00:36:22:04
Sgt Betsy Smith
And we've got to be able to recognize every single drug that's out there and who's on it and how they're going to act and all that. It's just it's become insurmountable. Right. The cops primary job is public safety and and we need to be able to enforce the law. And but I, I think one of the things our public does understand is that when we do enforce the law, we're just the first piece of it.
00:36:22:06 - 00:36:55:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
And we have taken we have taken prosecution out of policing and and that's why we have this term horrific crime problem right now. When you talk about criminal justice reform, the bigger issue of police reform, again, we're taking we're we're deep prosecuting bad guys. We've stopped vilifying the villains and we're just doing what? Vilifying cops. So there's a lot that needs to happen.
00:36:55:16 - 00:37:25:02
Sgt Betsy Smith
And we can continue to improve this profession. But they're just trying to stop us from day. The activists are just trying to stop us from doing their jobs. And now we see the result of that we see the result of overreaching police reform and we see the result of defunding the police. You know what would be so great when we talk about pleas for wouldn't it be great if every cop in this country had a bachelors degree, that'd be fantastic.
00:37:25:02 - 00:37:45:15
Sgt Betsy Smith
But we can't even get cops. We can't get anybody to apply for this job, much less somebody who has spent four years in college preparing for this job. So the defund the police movement actually has pulled the rug out from under much of the police reform that we could have been doing.
00:37:45:17 - 00:38:07:00
Wayne Mulder
Absolutely. Well, it's literally the opposite of what the statement should be, because if you want all these things to happen, you need to fund them. That's the way this process works. So you've got to put money into it. If you are truly trying to improve something, the only way to do it is through increased funding. This whole defund thing is an oxymoron at best.
00:38:07:02 - 00:38:23:07
Sgt Betsy Smith
Well, and that's the thing I get. I get questions constantly by the media and they ask this because they think I'm going to talk about how much I hate it. But they say, you know, a lot of the activists want more social workers in law enforcement. How do you feel about that? And they're expect me to say, hell no, we don't want to.
00:38:23:08 - 00:38:40:23
Sgt Betsy Smith
Social workers in lawnmowers and in reality and I tell them this is that in a perfect every patrol cop would be riding around with a full time, well educated social worker sitting next to them. How great. I mean, think about that.
00:38:40:23 - 00:38:41:13
Wayne Mulder
Yeah.
00:38:41:15 - 00:39:14:13
Sgt Betsy Smith
How how much easier would your job be if you could turn next to you when you're going next to when you're going to your next violent domestic and have an MSW or and she has W sitting next to you going, okay, how do you want to handle this? And but no, you know what? Nobody wants to pay for that because when you've got somebody with a master's degree sitting next to you in that patrol car, what are you going to have to pay them and what else are you going to have to train them to be able to do, i.e. protect themselves?
00:39:14:15 - 00:39:26:05
Sgt Betsy Smith
In fact, why don't we just say that every single police officer should have a master's degree in social work or psychology? How about that? Wouldn't that be great? Nobody wants to pay for it.
00:39:26:07 - 00:39:42:18
Wayne Mulder
Yep. And then you have the flipside of that because I'm very familiar with co responder programs and all flying. That's something we can talk about, but something I have a lot of experience on right now and one of the other issues is getting the people on that side of the House to want to do it. It's not as easy.
00:39:42:18 - 00:39:47:22
Wayne Mulder
I mean, they think that all these social workers want to come and ride around with cops all day. And that's not true either.
00:39:47:24 - 00:40:01:09
Sgt Betsy Smith
No. And they're not encouraged to see that side of things when they're in school. And, you know, if you know, you talk about co responders, I mean, that would be a perfect world.
00:40:01:12 - 00:40:03:21
Wayne Mulder
Absolutely. It's a great system.
00:40:04:00 - 00:40:33:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
It works well. You know, and this it they it and obviously you know this. But I you know, again, I got hired in 1980 in my little police department in Nigeria, in the suburbs where he had to police for please social workers on staff, please. Social workers have been around for decades and decades and they're invaluable. But again, you know, if you if you want more police, social workers, you can't take millions and millions of dollars out of our police budgets to be able to do that.
00:40:33:16 - 00:40:35:20
Sgt Betsy Smith
It's just it's illogical, Right?
00:40:36:00 - 00:40:43:13
Wayne Mulder
It's never going to work. Something you touched on there that I was leading to. I'm going somewhere with those.
00:40:43:15 - 00:41:07:05
Wayne Mulder
For simplicity, I'll just say the Soros days. But the issue is these prosecutors and we're seeing it in all these cities, and the only exceptions that I'm seeing is when you have strong governors like DeSantis that are willing to pull them out of there and say, you need to do do your job. But is that a problem that can be fixed?
00:41:07:07 - 00:41:37:13
Sgt Betsy Smith
Well, for example, we just had Larry Krasner in Pennsylvania impeached in Philadelphia. And I said, well, no fear. Pittsburgh, Philadelphia. Right. You know, so he's one of those Soros installed days. You saw Chesa Bodin in San Francisco, another Soros installed D.A. who was recalled. So now they've tried to recall George Gascon in L.A. County. That was unsuccessful. But that's what's going to happen.
00:41:37:13 - 00:42:05:04
Sgt Betsy Smith
But here's the problem. It goes state to state. There's different laws, appropriately so the United States, it's different, you know, and this is why New York, if Lee Zeldin would have been elected as governor, he could have removed the Manhattan D.A. who is is just letting people walk in so many, you know, for so many different crimes. So, you know, now in Illinois, where I come from, it's different.
00:42:05:04 - 00:42:34:09
Sgt Betsy Smith
The governor cannot remove the state's attorney. We can't. So so it depends. But that is one of the biggest problems we have in our criminal justice system right now. Police, please, can we can arrest every single bad guy in our town. But what people need to understand is we take that bad guy, we take that case against a bad guy, whether it's armed robbery or burglary or murder or whatever.
00:42:34:11 - 00:42:57:21
Sgt Betsy Smith
And we hand that over to a district attorney or a state's attorney, a prosecutor, and they are the ones who present their case to the judge. They are the ones who make a lot of determinations about what happens to that case. A great example is the shooting we just had of the football players by a fellow teammate in Virginia.
00:42:58:00 - 00:43:27:07
Sgt Betsy Smith
Yes, that shooter who killed, I believe it was four fellow students. He had been charged he had been arrested for weapons offenses before. He had been charged with violent felonies. All of that got pled down by a prosecutor's office to some sort of misdemeanor with a $100 fine and six months of probation. And then he was able to go back pass a background check, inexplicably, and and get another gun.
00:43:27:07 - 00:43:54:00
Sgt Betsy Smith
So people need to understand that when you have a lax criminal justice system because of these George Soros installed prosecutors that we have in Chicago and Seattle and Portland and L.A. and and Manhattan, and we could go on and on there, combined with a governor who can't or won't do anything, then your crime is going to continue to rise.
00:43:54:00 - 00:44:25:14
Sgt Betsy Smith
And you talked about Florida and what did Sanders did, removing a district attorney who wouldn't follow the law. Conversely, in Jacksonville, Florida, and that area, they have a prosecutor who is she is amazing and she is a take no prisoners prosecutor, if you will. If you if you violate a gun law and commit a violent crime with a gun, you're gone and you're going to spend significant time in prison.
00:44:25:20 - 00:44:33:23
Sgt Betsy Smith
And she's taken Jacksonville, Florida, which used to be a pretty dangerous city, and she's making it safe again. That's what we need to do everywhere.
00:44:34:00 - 00:44:53:02
Wayne Mulder
Yes, I couldn't agree more. And I'm hopeful and I love what you said because it really solve so many of these problems you hear in the media, which is kind of the world you're in a lot when it comes to the media world. And here all these things. And one of the other ones, of course, is obviously the war on the Second Amendment.
00:44:53:04 - 00:45:02:20
Wayne Mulder
But if we would just, like you said, just go with the laws we have on the books and actually prosecute people we wouldn't even have this conversation or need to have this conversation.
00:45:02:22 - 00:45:38:12
Sgt Betsy Smith
Well, and that's one of the things the National Police Association has been very much in the forefront about. We are the most Second Amendment supporting police organization in this country. We believe that our citizens should have the freedom to purchase, train with and utilize legal firearms to protect themselves. Because we know and now more than ever, that there are not enough cops to be able to keep every single citizen safe.
00:45:38:12 - 00:46:07:16
Sgt Betsy Smith
In fact, we've gotten involved in cases, for example, in Minneapolis, Minnesota, where we filed amicus briefs on behalf of the citizens who, because of their prosecutor and because of their attorney general, weren't getting the type of police service they deserved. So we filed, on behalf of the citizens to get better police protection. And that's one of the other things we're doing is we're we're being vocal about the Second Amendment.
00:46:07:18 - 00:46:29:00
Sgt Betsy Smith
You know, you people hear in the media all the time, oh, police officers, you know, the police want more gun control. Police officers don't want more gun control. You'll hear from certain police leaders, primarily big city police chiefs, Oh, we need more gun control. We know more gun control is the answer. But they talk about it because that's what their mayors and boards want them to talk about.
00:46:29:00 - 00:46:43:06
Sgt Betsy Smith
That's why sheriffs tend to be more Second Amendment friendly than do big city police chiefs. We don't need more gun laws. We need prosecutors that will use the gun laws. We have to punish the people who commit gun crime.
00:46:43:08 - 00:47:06:06
Wayne Mulder
Absolutely. In fact, I had a podcast that I do two shows. I do the interview show, and I do something called Morning Roll Call. And about a month or so ago, I had that monologue show and the whole premise of it was, you are the first responder talking to citizens. And it's true because even in the best case scenarios where you have a lot of law enforcement, then get there, it can still be five, 10 minutes and things are over.
00:47:06:06 - 00:47:07:09
Wayne Mulder
By the time we get there.
00:47:07:11 - 00:47:29:07
Sgt Betsy Smith
So say say when trouble is seconds away, police are minutes away. You know, I mean, that's just the reality of the situation is, you know, and you look at, you know, whether it's workplace violence, school violence, whatever it is, armed trained citizens can make a difference not only in their own safety, but in the in the safety of their fellow citizens.
00:47:29:07 - 00:47:41:15
Sgt Betsy Smith
You know, we saw this. You know, people will remember because hardly any coverage. But, you know, a few months ago in Indianapolis, we had an armed train, citizens stepping in and we're all shooting and stop it. Yeah. And then within.
00:47:41:15 - 00:47:43:01
Wayne Mulder
Seconds.
00:47:43:03 - 00:47:44:19
Sgt Betsy Smith
Within seconds. Exactly.
00:47:45:00 - 00:47:50:15
Wayne Mulder
Yeah. Yeah. That was phenomenal, too, because the distance on the shots was better than typical.
00:47:50:15 - 00:47:51:08
Sgt Betsy Smith
Is incredible.
00:47:51:11 - 00:47:52:17
Wayne Mulder
Yeah. I've never seen.
00:47:52:17 - 00:47:53:22
Sgt Betsy Smith
That they couldn't shoot that well.
00:47:53:23 - 00:48:14:12
Wayne Mulder
Exactly. I've never seen that it stops. So just couple more questions for you. I kind of the elephant in the room with all of this and it's something you talk about is how obviously a lot of what we're talking about is how these issues have become political issues. But something you often say is that crime and safety issues should not be political issues.
00:48:14:12 - 00:48:24:11
Wayne Mulder
So how do we separate it speaking, you know, kind of to my audience, is there a way to separate it? Like, what is the the broader thoughts on this?
00:48:24:13 - 00:48:46:20
Sgt Betsy Smith
Well I think what is going to have to happen is people on both sides are all sides, if you will, because there's you know, there's the left, the right, there's the libertarians, there's the progressives, all of that. Everybody's going to have to admit, whether it's together or separately, that crime is a problem in the United States of America.
00:48:46:20 - 00:49:09:01
Sgt Betsy Smith
And we have got to be realistic about in other words, we have to be factual about who is committing crime and why they're committing it. We have to stop talking about, you know, all people are, you know, for example, after a riot, people are looting because they can't feed their families or people are doing carjackings because they're poor.
00:49:09:03 - 00:49:31:20
Sgt Betsy Smith
I am so sick of hearing people on both sides say, well, if we got a handle poverty, you know, we would be getting a handle on crime. Just because you're poor doesn't mean you're going to be a criminal or you are a criminal. I know tens of thousands of poor people throughout my life who are not criminals. We have got to go back to being scientific.
00:49:32:01 - 00:49:59:23
Sgt Betsy Smith
We have got to go back to understand learning that being a criminal is a conscious choice. And we have got to punish that conscious choice. We have got to vilify the villains and stop making excuses for them. And also we've got to stop vilifying the good guys who are trying to stop crime. So that can be that that none of that needs to be political.
00:50:00:04 - 00:50:05:03
Sgt Betsy Smith
We just have to be go back to being factual and realistic.
00:50:05:05 - 00:50:30:23
Wayne Mulder
I love that. Amen is what I'll say to that, because it is it's so powerful because how can candid sending is that right? And we do it with other groups as well. It's not just this crime conversation where it's almost like we say, you can't do this because, you know, because you're poor, you're going to commit crimes or because you have a certain affinities city, you know, because of certain situations, you you got to have a driver's license or.
00:50:30:23 - 00:50:56:00
Sgt Betsy Smith
Whatever, right? If you're poor, you're you're you're unable to go get your free. You know, I state I.D. I mean, it's just ridiculous. It's just I there there's something called the soft bigotry of low expectations. And we have to stop that on. We've got to stop looking at people and saying, oh, because you're this you're unable to do this.
00:50:56:02 - 00:51:20:12
Sgt Betsy Smith
This is the United States of America. And here I'm going to raise my flag and say, look, you know, this is the thing. The whole point of this country of this great experiment of the United States is that you can do anything and be anything, regardless of race, sexual orientation, socioeconomic circumstances. And we have gotten so far away from that.
00:51:20:12 - 00:51:48:06
Sgt Betsy Smith
We have bizarrely started putting people in little groups, in little boxes and and that and then that's where it becomes political. We have got to break out of that. And I think it really I think if we do it when we talk about crime and safety and policing, then I think it would bleed into other areas in a positive way.
00:51:48:08 - 00:52:10:10
Wayne Mulder
I think you're absolutely right. I mean, and I've said it and obviously there's some national radio hosts that I listen to say it all the time, but we have to get back to the our unum, our E pluribus unum. We have to get back to being one. And I couldn't agree with that more. What do you with someone with such an impressive resume and so many years in law enforcement, what do you see in the future?
00:52:10:11 - 00:52:21:13
Wayne Mulder
Like, what is your crystal ball, if you would? Look, we're both Christians. We don't use crystal balls. But nonetheless, if you were to see if you were to see the future, what would it look like?
00:52:21:15 - 00:52:38:12
Sgt Betsy Smith
I think we're going to have some more tough times coming up. I don't know how else to say that. And I just have to say, as a Christian, I you know, last last week, my husband walked into church and we both kind of looked and we're like, I just God's got to be splitting the firewood right now. You know, I just get ready to burn the whole thing down, you know?
00:52:38:12 - 00:53:03:18
Sgt Betsy Smith
So I say that. But I do think we're going to have some tough times coming up. And I when I say that, I mean from a law enforcement perspective, I think that this crime trend there were on is going to continue in certain areas. And that frustrates me as an American, because crime and safety, it shouldn't be political.
00:53:03:18 - 00:53:28:20
Sgt Betsy Smith
It also shouldn't be regional. Your safety shouldn't be regional. But I think what's going to happen is that the people who can leave cities like Chicago and Seattle and Portland and New York City and Pittsburgh, the people who are able are going to leave and will and who's going to be left there? People without the means to be able to leave.
00:53:28:20 - 00:53:46:04
Sgt Betsy Smith
And they're the ones who are going to have to deal this crime surge. And I think ultimately those are going to be the people that are going to to save themselves and save the country. But I think it's going to have to get even worse before it gets better.
00:53:46:06 - 00:53:48:23
Wayne Mulder
What is next for you and your mission?
00:53:49:00 - 00:54:31:20
Sgt Betsy Smith
So with the National Police Association, we are going to continue we are going to broaden our scope when it comes to talking about local and national issues. One of the things that we've started to do is to get on do more regional talk radio, because talk radio, you know, again, being totally apolitical and I've spoken to to talk radio personalities, you know, on the left, on the right in the middle, and the talk radio is where you can really discuss ideas, you know, when you're doing a television had, you know, a cable news set or even a network television, it you know, you've got to really limited amount of time.
00:54:31:22 - 00:54:56:19
Sgt Betsy Smith
And and so we're really branching out more into radio and where we can we can talk to people for ten or 15 minutes. And and of course, we've got the the our NPR rapport. We're we're going to continue to go out there and find just wonderful guests. We are filing amicus briefs to on all kinds of different cases.
00:54:56:19 - 00:55:31:07
Sgt Betsy Smith
We still have a few requests out there with the Border Patrol whipping case. Really, if you'll recall, we're now we know that Mr. Mayorkas knew that those weren't wimps, and yet he allowed the president to go on live national television and say, someone will pay. We are for requests out there. We are not going to stop till we get to the bottom of cases like that, where American law enforcement has been lied about, has been wrong, has been maligned, and we're not going to stop until we get the truth out there.
00:55:31:09 - 00:55:34:22
Wayne Mulder
I love that. And are they just stonewalling on those few requests so far?
00:55:34:22 - 00:56:05:04
Sgt Betsy Smith
Yes, they are. But we're not going to give up. And you know, you're going to see Mr. Mayorkas have to come and testify before the legislature. And and so hopefully that's the thing. Our legal team is tenacious and and they have the right heart because they have the heart for not just American law enforcement officers, but they have the heart for the American public and and and that's the difference with the National Police Association, because it's not just about taking care of cops.
00:56:05:04 - 00:56:11:17
Sgt Betsy Smith
We want to take care of the people that deserve our protection from American law enforcement.
00:56:11:19 - 00:56:20:11
Wayne Mulder
Yes. And you can't have good law enforcement without the community. It is a relationship that has be together. Otherwise, here we are.
00:56:20:11 - 00:56:24:00
Sgt Betsy Smith
The police and the police are the people. Well, it goes back to Robert Beal. Right?
00:56:24:02 - 00:56:40:06
Wayne Mulder
Exactly. My last question for you and this is a question I ask everyone who comes on the show, and we've touched on so many things that probably qualifies answers for it. But what is the one take away the one thing that law enforcement officers can do that's going to make a difference in their personal lives?
00:56:40:08 - 00:57:11:15
Sgt Betsy Smith
That's huge, though. I would say that the one thing that every law enforcement officer in the country should do is to get involved. Whatever your religious beliefs are, get involved in a some sort of spiritual religious, whether it's, you know, program, whatever, whether you're Christian, Muslim, Jewish, whatever it is, understand that there is something bigger than you out there.
00:57:11:15 - 00:57:51:10
Sgt Betsy Smith
And frankly, it's essential to your officers survival. That belief system embrace that belief system in something bigger than you, whatever that is, and move forward with that in your life. You find so much peace, so much joy and and so much more meaning in your life because it's really easy to become and stay cynical in this job. But if you understand there's a greater good out there, a greater presence, a greater being, something bigger than you, it will bring you so much peace and joy.
00:57:51:12 - 00:58:00:13
Wayne Mulder
I couldn't agree with you more. As one who talks about spiritual wellness all the time, I couldn't agree anymore that answer. What is the best way for people to connect with you?
00:58:00:15 - 00:58:38:05
Sgt Betsy Smith
So if you want to learn more about the National Police Association, you can visit us at National Police. Dot org. Don't google us. You'll come up with all kinds of hate. So go to national police dot org. My website is female horses dot com or box savage dot com. Follow me on Twitter you will see the political side of Sergeant Betsy Smith Steve Betsy Smith and and we have some fun It's a pretty pretty raucous place but go to national police that are read articles see our show go to our YouTube page and see some of the shows that we do.
00:58:38:05 - 00:58:44:00
Sgt Betsy Smith
We just talk to amazing people in in and out of this profession.
00:58:44:02 - 00:58:55:15
Wayne Mulder
Wonderful. I will link all that up and it is a great YouTube channel and I do like the Twitter post. So Betsy, thank you so much for coming on. It's been a true pleasure to meet you and have this hour to sit and talk with you.
00:58:55:17 - 00:58:59:07
Sgt Betsy Smith
Thanks so much for having me. This is this was a fun discussion.
00:58:59:09 - 00:59:18:09
Wayne Mulder
Thank you. So how was that? Thank you for watching. Thank you for listening. Remember, this is always on YouTube and Rumble. And then I do take the morning roll calls and I put those on X as well where you can follow and watch the complete episodes on there. So thank you for watching or listening. I hope you enjoyed it.
00:59:18:09 - 00:59:34:18
Wayne Mulder
Every episode, full show notes and everything about it, whatever streaming service you're watching this on, if you just go down to on the blue line dot com and then you'll see the forward slash show notes, click on that link. He'll take you to the show notes for that episode. And on there you'll have access to really more than you could ever consume.
00:59:34:18 - 00:59:51:03
Wayne Mulder
Well, that might not be completely true, but it's a lot and there's a lot of links, and everything we discussed is on there and you can follow those links and go as deep into that rabbit hole as you desire. So thank you so much for coming back week after week. I have a new episode for you again next week.
00:59:51:05 - 01:00:02:01
Wayne Mulder
That is all for today. Don't forget, I'm going to see you next Monday in Morning. Roll Call. I will see you next Thursday in the interview room. But in the meantime and as always, I'll see you out there on the blue line.